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Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

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Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#121

Post by VLM »

maxerickson wrote: post #96
vfclists wrote: post #92

There is a reason why truck operators in Africa prefer the older trucks which don't have these fancy electronics. Servicing and parts are not a problem. This whole business about semiconductors shortages affecting vehicle manufacturing is just ridiculous. Humanity has survived without these advanced electronics for ages. What difference doesn't make if you don't have electronic geegaws in your vehicle?

Electronic powertrain controllers make vehicles more efficient and more reliable, it isn't just the power mirrors that need chips.

Not anymore. That's the point. Times have changed and they make trucks less efficient and less reliable.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#122

Post by prmoustache »

gambiting wrote: post #97
prmoustache wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to forget that bar exceptions (people working on the road all day), most passenger cars are staying parked 99% of the time and use for small errands. The aptera is also built to provide up to 1000miles in its highest spec out of one complete charge.

Right and how long does it take to charge that 1000 mile range in an average British city? A full year? And I'm not forgetting it - I'm just saying that the overall gain doesn't seem to be worth it. The cost of solar panels integrated into the car would pay for a lot of electricity from the grid instead.

The aptera is still plugable and you would still benefit from the efficiency even in sorry sad UK...And I have seen nowhere anyone saying it was for everyone. It only have 2 seats and limited luggage capacity for a start, it won't replace a family van.

I live in Andalusia where decent sunlight is all year and I would love a similar thing with 4 seats. With only 2 I don't really see the advantage over using my motorbike which is much easier to park.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#123

Post by heartbreak »

VLM wrote: post #120
rasz wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of manufacturers discovered shortages are mega profitable, making them reluctant to see it as a problem.

I've been trying to buy stuff and most of the money goes to the middlemen scalpers. I made a mistake in a post above, I thought Raspberry PI 2 W were still retail priced at $5, like the old days of the zero (of course those were unobtainable by most people at $5 even in good economic times). So the Pi foundation is selling for $15 and the market on Amazon has cleared everything for sale below $149. It would be fair t…

This is why Raspberry Pi used to only sell through specific distributors.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#124

Post by bluGill »

yakak wrote: post #94
tlb wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but if you made photocopies of all the pages, rearranged and sold them it would be. Modifying software almost always involves copying. Some (older) technologies like punched cards allow modification without any copying. But if you're loading firmware from a device onto your laptop and using an editor, there are plenty of copies being made throughout the process.

I think that is far more literal a focus on copying than the courts have, they tend to think in terms of whether you are expanding the number of copies. I think courts sided with an artist that destroyed an original in transfers making one new work. I think they would also tend to side with firmware users that move/modify copies but don't expand the number of production units running derived copies of the code.

More importantly courts are smart enough to realize that the act of copying a webpage to various caches on internet routers, then to memory of your computer, and your browser's cache files is not copyright infringement even though copies were made. It would be if you saved the source code in your browser and shared the webpage with others - but even then depending on details it might be called fair use if such a thing came to court.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#125

Post by bluGill »

nathanaldensr wrote: post #40
zardo wrote: post #14

Also, a rash of power train control module failures leaves Freightliner trucks inoperable, and a shortage of spare parts sees commercial trucking companies turning to the black market for stolen parts.

I was thinking that, too. The thieves just steal the same modules over and over as each trucking line buys them from the black market. Nice business if you can get it.

This is why modern cars and tractors encode the VIN in computers and don't let you replace parts without dealer tools. You buy a black market part, even though it is perfectly good it can't be used without the dealer getting involved and the dealer tool can automatically check against a list of stolen parts.

Right to repair has the downside of not checking for stolen parts like that. Which is why it isn't the black and white issue most people think it is.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#126

Post by bluGill »

janekm wrote: post #91
prmoustache wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So how long does the microchip shortage continue? In my humble opinion, there is no shortage. There is however a huge priorization and a control of the production to elevate the prices. I guess some people in far east asia figured out they have power the same way as the founders of OPEP did in the 70's. Look at all the microchips based shit you can buy on aliexpress. Doesn't seem they are affected much by shortage.

From what I've seen Chinese manufacturers and component distributors built up big stocks when the tariffs/sanctions against China were announced a few years ago. Then when the recent events affected supply chains, they were sitting on decent stocks of popular chips and were able to sell them at 10x original price. Since then the industry has been in a cycle of: - Manufacturer finishes a batch of popular chip - Everyb…

Manufactures should be aware of this. Selling to real customers as opposed to scalpers is better in the long run because when those scalpers realize the game is up they will flood the market. However us little guys who need just one, or maybe a few hundred are not big enough for the manufactures to talk to individually even though we are significant overall. The manufactures don't really have a way to get us supply that scalpers cannot get into. Big companies generally can get supply if it exists. That is a big if though, as there are real supply problems as well.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#127

Post by bluGill »

VLM wrote: post #117
Syonyk wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So how long does the microchip shortage continue? Warning: Paid Pessimist point of view (I've done computer security for far, far too long). Indefinitely. It doesn't recover. Because (modern, leading process) microchips are the sort of globe spanning supply chain problem that works great, right up until it doesn't. Coolant for some laser is made in this country that's at war. Some critical surface processing chemic…

Roll back the tech level and go vertical silo. The auto industry buys bolts and makes pistons because the marketplace can't make pistons, roughly. They have the know how if the bolt marketplace collapsed to turn steel rod into bolts, maybe not as easily and cheaply as it can be done now, but if the bolt market died they'd make their own bolts. The commodity microcontroller is dead. My guess is crappy "homemade" older…

A fab is $5billion. I know of a large company (I'm not allowed to say who, but you might be able to guess) that when faced with some 16bit CPU going out of production considered building a fab - manufacturing is the core competency, so why shouldn't they make our own chips, and thus keep those old designs based in obsolete CPUs that still work just find running for longer. The cost of a fab was high enough they decided not to. Of course on hindsight if they had built a fab it would have opened just as the supply chain problems started, and the company would have made a mint.

I don't think GM will open a fab on their own. Too expensive for what they need. However a joint GM/Ford/Toyota venture seems possible (if it can get past anti-trust laws!), and that would find customers in the likes of Honda.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#128

Post by konschubert »

bluGill wrote: post #125
nathanaldensr wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking that, too. The thieves just steal the same modules over and over as each trucking line buys them from the black market. Nice business if you can get it.

This is why modern cars and tractors encode the VIN in computers and don't let you replace parts without dealer tools. You buy a black market part, even though it is perfectly good it can't be used without the dealer getting involved and the dealer tool can automatically check against a list of stolen parts. Right to repair has the downside of not checking for stolen parts like that. Which is why it isn't the black a…

Or we could have a police force that prosecutes theft.

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#129

Post by PaulHoule »

maxerickson wrote: post #95
Thorrez wrote: post #67

>The company will consider civil actions for software infringement against those involved in CPC theft and mismanagement. What is software infringement? Does it mean copyright infringement? Stealing a piece of hardware isn't copyright infringment, although maybe some types of reprogramming it would be. Kind of funny. I've heard people call copyright infringement theft before, but I've never heard anyone call theft co…

The software for a given vehicle will be specialized for the engine and other powertrain components. It's likely that manufacturer tools and licenses are being used to change the programming on the stolen components.

It's like modding a game console

https://mynintendonews.com/2022/02/06/us-government-wants-ga...

Re: Rash of parts thefts is leaving Freightliner trucks inoperable

#130

Post by bluGill »

bob1029 wrote: post #84
UncleEntity wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Collision avoidance that likes to have false alarms going around curves on wet, sub-freezing roads. Auto transmission that wants to downshift into redline going down hills. General unpredictable behavior on slick roads where it is pretty important to be able to pick your gear. Partially this is the company’s fault because they turn off a bunch of stuff for “fuel economy”.

Why does something with as much mass as a semi truck have the ability to wrest control away from the operator in the first place? Collision avoidance nannies seem substantially more tolerable when the physics equation has 2 zeroes removed from the mass figure. It's not like arbitrary jackasses can get behind the wheel of these vehicles anyways... there is a reason a commercial licensing program exists.

> Why does something with as much mass as a semi truck have the ability to wrest control away from the operator in the first place?

Because humans - even highly trained professional drivers (who are in general much better than the average person on the road) are terrible drivers that make mistakes all the time. Not to mention humans drivers are limited to two eyes looking in one direction (checking the mirrors takes your eyes off the road, so while you should it is a compromise), a computer has a lot more potential for inputs that humans cannot see.

Now I will admit that making safety programs that work right in all cases is a hard problem. However it is competing against an imperfect system.

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