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Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

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Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#121

Post by ricochet11 »

edent wrote: post #49
lordofgibbons wrote: post #10

I will gladly stop using Monero if someone can tell me how to privately transact over the internet without CC companies (and others) spying on me and selling my data. Until there is a better solution, I'll keep using it.

I understand this privacy argument - but I'm wondering what the practical downside is of this "spying"? I've been using credit cards online for decades and I am yet to encounter anything negative from doing so. I get that my credit card provider knows that I'm buying £X of goods from merchant Y. But unless that merchant is very specific, the card company doesn't know what I've bought. And, if it did... so what? Perha…

not long ago here where i live today it was illegal to be gay, i would have been locked up/ chemically "treated"/ killed. It took people doing illegal things and being able to organise and communicate to build their defence and solidarity so they could stand together and push back against the violence and injustice of the state.

its not that the credit card company might sell you a rainbow card, its that you might not even get to exist.

Many things are illegal, but not immoral. You have probably broken the law in your life, most people have. ultimate surveillance is damaging to society as it strips away our ability to change "how things are done around here". I know a few sex workers whove had their bank accounts frozen and forced into cash/crypto, is that fair? are they really causing damage to society? theres many examples of sexism/racism from bank managers giving mortgages/loans with different rates depending on who they are talking to, could we use zkproofs to prove income/assets/liabilities without revealing personal information? amongst all the hype and speculation (caused by desperation in our current systems) crypto is about these issues and is doing real work to address them.

and thats before we even get into how things might change in the future. maybe its fine for a credit card company to know if you are gay today, what about in ten years? what if it becomes a crime again?

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#122

Post by mypastself »

gnomewascool wrote: post #107
mypastself wrote: post #74

Somewhat relatedly, I’ve been wondering for a while now why so many people here are so intensely, emotionally against this tech (and consequently why so many mediocre articles on the topic with emotionally charged titles are upvoted to the front page). Plenty of different arguments are offered by the commentariat, some of which have merit. But whether the stated reasons are environmental issues, political implication…

> I’m speculating about the reasons for the disproportionate level of ire directed against crypto on this forum I don't personally know any people who became rich on cryptocurrencies and also don't feel any particular envy towards the people who I know of, via the internet, but am pretty vehemently against cryptocurrencies, so I'm a sample-size one counter-example to your thesis. I obviously don't think that my ire a…

That’s fair, but your comment on the topic is significantly more measured than is customary for this forum. (If your usual comments are more along the lines of “God I hope this MLM cult crashes and burns soon”, than you fit my idea of angry anti-crypto HN commenter more closely.)

Thanks for reminding me to reread the Scott Alexander outgroup article.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#123

Post by thawaya3113 »

Havoc wrote: post #44

>help me make it die in a fire I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. If it really is that devoid of merit it'll die on its own. I also think it is a rather fundamental failure to see the big picture. Not efficient? Well neither was the Ford model T. Newer generations are getting better. Similarly somehow existing systems seem to get a free pass for things that are…

Lol at complaining about being frothy against crypto when crypto is nothing other than HODL Diamond hands cultists (I say cultists to be nice and not call them grifters and scam artists).

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#124

Post by prepend »

peyton wrote: post #117
wlll wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. I don't really give a crap about what people do or don't do with new technology, ultimately what people want to spend their time and money on is up to them. However, "Crypto" is different. If all it was was just the unbelievably irritating crypto bros rug pulling, ponzi scheming, wash trading, ugly NFT shilling and hacking a…

> So far no-one has been able to point me at a single thing that public public blockchains do that either is worth doing and is only possible using blockchain tech, or is better (more power efficient, faster) than using pre-existing technology. Using privacy coins I can donate money to causes I believe in (eg WikiLeaks) without fear of reprisal and with the knowledge that the funds will reach their recipient. If you…

This is a good use case for crypto, but it’s ruined by all the speculation and boom/bust.

I don’t need $30,000k Bitcoin to support Wikileaks and my blogger. $10 Bitcoin works perfectly for this.

But people hype and fraud coins to heights they shouldn’t be and make it useless for actual use.

I think Eth is a good idea. I like smart contracts. But Etherium doesn’t need to be $3k and transactions shouldn’t be $10. $1 Eth and $.01 transactions is still perfectly fine for a sustainable system. But that doesn’t make people millions and billions by milking idiots.

I think if we had regulators preventing wash and pump and dump then we can just pick dogecoin or whatever and move on to digital cash. Until then, it’s not going to be possible with dogecoin going up 10x and down .1x along with everything else.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#125

Post by prepend »

bambax wrote: post #110
Havoc wrote: post #44

>help me make it die in a fire I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. If it really is that devoid of merit it'll die on its own. I also think it is a rather fundamental failure to see the big picture. Not efficient? Well neither was the Ford model T. Newer generations are getting better. Similarly somehow existing systems seem to get a free pass for things that are…

> The people certain it'll be a disaster seem just as silly... I'm not certain, unfortunately. But I'm hoping.

Based on its fundamentals it should be a disaster. But it should have been a disaster for 10 years and hasn’t crashed yet.

I’m not certain it’s a disaster and I don’t hope for its failure. But I’m against it like I’m against best buy warranties or whole life insurance.

They are bad things that shouldn’t exist and no one should buy them.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#126

Post by _Algernon_ »

giantrobot wrote: post #118
_Algernon_ wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our entire fossil fuel driven economy is also "wasteful by design".

Fossil fuels are used to make just about every thing you touch. That's the opposite of waste. They're utilized. They can't be replenished but they're certainly not wasted.

Things being so cheap due to fossil fuels that you buy new things instead of fixing them is wasteful. And there is value in CCs, even if you personally don't find them valuable. They money that is zero trust, private, and eliminates some mechanisms of manipulation (inflation). Let's not forget that bitcoin grew out of the financial crisis and the mismanagement of monetary policy leading up to it.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#127

Post by thawaya3113 »

basisword wrote: post #113
wlll wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. I don't really give a crap about what people do or don't do with new technology, ultimately what people want to spend their time and money on is up to them. However, "Crypto" is different. If all it was was just the unbelievably irritating crypto bros rug pulling, ponzi scheming, wash trading, ugly NFT shilling and hacking a…

>> 1) a very serious climate crisis 2) a cost of living crisis where people can't afford energy to cook and heat (in the UK at least) and 3) a war that would likely be brought to a stop sooner if we could phase out Russian gas sooner. All of these things are the result of bad governing, not crypto. Maybe banning crypto would help them (I don’t believe that) but banning lots of other things would also help. What we re…

Nothing is crypto’s fault.

We get it.

It’s not cryptos fault that it’s a terrible currency. Just invest in it. It’s not crypto’s fault that it’s a terrible investment. Why don’t you want a great currency that government doesn’t control? It’s not crypto’s fault that half the money in the ecosystem is stolen. Why isn’t the government helping this anti governmental technology? It’s not crypto’s fault that the vast majority of the coins are scams. It only failed because Citadel and Blackstone attacked it.

No, crypto is pure and faultless. And anything that it does wrong is the fault of the government and/or Blackstone and Citadel and/or the Paper Hands.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#128

Post by abalone »

basisword wrote: post #113
wlll wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. I don't really give a crap about what people do or don't do with new technology, ultimately what people want to spend their time and money on is up to them. However, "Crypto" is different. If all it was was just the unbelievably irritating crypto bros rug pulling, ponzi scheming, wash trading, ugly NFT shilling and hacking a…

>> 1) a very serious climate crisis 2) a cost of living crisis where people can't afford energy to cook and heat (in the UK at least) and 3) a war that would likely be brought to a stop sooner if we could phase out Russian gas sooner. All of these things are the result of bad governing, not crypto. Maybe banning crypto would help them (I don’t believe that) but banning lots of other things would also help. What we re…

What like a policy that bans extremely energy intensive things that offer no value other than to construct Ponzi schemes at rapid clip? Yeah we need that policy.

(Happy to hear what value crypto offers that can’t be done with more energy efficient mechanisms.)

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#129

Post by danaris »

PaulHoule wrote: post #114
wlll wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. I don't really give a crap about what people do or don't do with new technology, ultimately what people want to spend their time and money on is up to them. However, "Crypto" is different. If all it was was just the unbelievably irritating crypto bros rug pulling, ponzi scheming, wash trading, ugly NFT shilling and hacking a…

It is like a viral infection. Once somebody spends $400,000 on an ugly ape and then found they spent their money for nothing, they will become a permanent enemy of crypto. It’s just a matter of time before you join us (crypto haters) the difference is that some of us knew it was a scam right away and others will have to learn it the hard way.

I dunno; from what I’ve seen, that depends on the personality of the person involved.

Some people will react the way you say, yes, but others, after spending $400k or whatever for a worthless NFT, or for some combination of “coins”, will double down, unwilling or unable to let themselves see the truth because that would mean they were wrong in a spectacular fashion.

So they push for crypto harder than ever, to get other people to come in, prop the system up, keep the value of their purchase up, and validate their worldview.

Re: Why All Cryptocurrency Should Die in a Fire

#130

Post by wlll »

peyton wrote: post #117
wlll wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm rather mistrustful of people that are this forthy about being against a new technology. I don't really give a crap about what people do or don't do with new technology, ultimately what people want to spend their time and money on is up to them. However, "Crypto" is different. If all it was was just the unbelievably irritating crypto bros rug pulling, ponzi scheming, wash trading, ugly NFT shilling and hacking a…

> So far no-one has been able to point me at a single thing that public public blockchains do that either is worth doing and is only possible using blockchain tech, or is better (more power efficient, faster) than using pre-existing technology. Using privacy coins I can donate money to causes I believe in (eg WikiLeaks) without fear of reprisal and with the knowledge that the funds will reach their recipient. If you…

You mean like monero (https://ciphertrace.com/enhanced-monero-tracing/) or something else perhaps? Are you sure it's private?

Private or not, which country are you in that would penalise you if you donated to Wikileaks?

Ultimately though, there's a decent argument for /not/ allowing completely anonymous money transfers as the list of organisations that you'd be penalised for donating to probably has a pretty strong overlap with the list of organisations that society as a whole, through it's government, has decided we don't want to receive money.

Crypto /might/ allow you to make an end-run around this system, but do we want it to, and even if we do, is it worth an entire country's electricity usage?

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