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Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

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Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#121

Post by assttoasstmgr »

Groxx wrote: post #86
caymanjim wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not wrong, but it is whack-a-mole, and this is one of our hammers.

Part of the problem is that it's a rather terrible, leaky, and easily-worked-around hammer. It mostly only continues to work because they haven't bothered to do simple things to prevent their more technical users from blocking it.

I previously had some Roku devices in my house and they immediately went into a restricted VLAN not for the least of reasons that their ToS/privacy policy stated I was agreeing to give them permission to collect data about my network and send it back to them. Whatever that means.

Roku devices hardcode 8.8.8.8 DNS in their software. So a Pi-Hole would be useless in a typical config. Evident by the constant hammering of dns.google in my firewall logs (dropped).

DNS filtering can only be effective if you intercept/drop all other outbound DNS traffic at the edge of your network.

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#123

Post by JohnTHaller »

jjulius wrote: post #52
e2le wrote: post #36

Is the Pi-Hole even reasonably effective these days? > Nearly 70% of smart TVs and 46% of game consoles were found to contain hardcoded DNS settings - allowing them to simply ignore your local network’s DNS server entirely. https://labzilla.io/blog/force-dns-pihole

Yes; PiHoles are used for far more than just blocking smart TVs. The difference between browsing the web at my house and browsing away from home is so stark that it's almost not worth browsing most sites if I'm not behind it.

Curious why you're not using Firefox + uBlock Origin. It does CNAME lookups.

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#124

Post by NavinF »

DistractionRect wrote: post #119
eli wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of the biggest ISPs in the US are actively monitoring DNS queries, collecting the data of which sites you visit, and packaging it for sale to ad networks and data brokers. DoH stops that.

It really doesn't, as server name indication is sent in clear text. As encrypted SNI didnt take off, you dont actually get privacy benefits from DoH and friends, just security/mild inconvenience to censors.

> encrypted SNI didnt take off

Says who? I think your data is very old considering that ECH replaced ESNI 2 years ago. IIRC it has ~50% adoption, same as TLS 1.3. Just about every company that cares about security supported ECH for years.

Moreover, someone has to move first. If DoH wasn’t widely deployed you’d be complaining that ECH is useless because DNS is unencrypted.

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#125

Post by danielheath »

syshum wrote: post #46
danielheath wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Block port 443 and configure machines to use an http proxy with a cert installed?

that would be a nightmare to manage and impractical for most home networks

Sure, but if you’re rolling out an SOE for a business it’s really not much more work.

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#126

Post by LeoPanthera »

paulcole wrote: post #110
LeoPanthera wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. It's actually very difficult to buy a non-smart TV. They usually cost more. 2. The comments also serve as a "no really, don't block these" reminder to enthusiastic contributors.

> It's actually very difficult to buy a non-smart TV. They usually cost more So is it very difficult to buy a non-smart TV or do they just cost more?

Both!

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#127

Post by jeena »

chillfox wrote: post #116
walterbell wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smart TV retail prices are subsidized by revenue from data analytics on content search and viewing. Web browsers are subsidized (free) by search (ad) revenue.

I would rather pay more for a TV than have it subsidized by ads. Or even better, a TV with no smart features, then I can just connect a computer for whatever smarts I want.

That is what I always do, HDMI is great for that.

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#129

Post by mrspeaker »

paulcole wrote: post #112
throwawayboise wrote: post #56

I'll be that guy: I sidestep the problem by not having a TV.

I sidedstepped the problem by buying a nice TV and not caring about ads or what the thing is doing w/ my wifi. Of all the things for me to get worked up over, this isn’t one of them.

Just wondering... (really interested, not being snarky!) I see this opinion with family members and other people who aren't in tech/computers (the majority of people). I figured it was because they don't know how impressive data science has become.

But you most likely do know: so what would it actually take to make you care about what they are doing over your wifi?

Transmit every remote control button push? Send hashes of audio keywords recorded from you talking and use that to recommend shows/products? Raw lidar data? Raw audio/video recording of you/your house?

Is there potentially a line they could cross, or is data just data, and therefore equally fair game?

Re: Smart-TV blocklist for Pi-Hole

#130

Post by confident_inept »

the_snooze wrote: post #15
confident_inept wrote: post #2

Praise be the folks that curate these lists. Even without a pi-hole you can plug these into any firewall for your brand(s). More annoying is the 15 second "home menu" that pops up on my OLED every time it is turned on. I almost always forget to manually dismiss it before I set the remote down and there's no option I can find to disable it. I would pay a premium for a TV with no internet connection.

>I would pay a premium for a TV with no internet connection. I bought a Samsung QLED TV recently, and it works fine without an internet connection. I did give it an ethernet connection to grab firmware updates, and it downloaded a bunch of ads and crap to clutter the home screen. Luckily, unplugging the ethernet cord and factory-resetting the device got rid of the garbage and kept the updated firmware.

I can always deny internet via MAC address, but a modern panel that just turns on instantly and works is the stuff of dreams.
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