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When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

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Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#121

Post by ars »

sockaddr wrote: post #113
champagnois wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Question: How do we reconcile "soy is poison" with the fact that some cultures include massive amounts of soy in their diet with little known detriment? For instance, the Japanese seem to eat tons of the stuff in various forms all the time but they seem to lead healthy lives. I don't have any skin in the game, just curious.

I have no authoritative knowledge here, but the typical answer is they eat mostly fermented soy. I personally have no idea if that actually matters, but that's the answer I've heard.

Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#124

Post by tasty_freeze »

champagnois wrote: post #53
version_five wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah who knows what unequivocal advice we could be getting from experts right now that will be thoroughly debunked 70 years from now. (Are dairy and grains still food groups... I could easily go on)

Quoted post unavailable.

> Soy is poison

The concern about soy in infant food is well placed, but your broad statement is hyperbolic.

I don't know where you are, but I'm in the US, where 2/3 of adults are overweight, and half of them are obese. Whatever effect soy has on our endocrine systems, it is dwarfed by the effects caused by body fat itself.

As for the effect of soy on adults, for most people there is no problem unless they have excessive soy consumption, and those problems are fixed simply by eating less soy. Soy also has known health benefits, and an honest discussion would weigh the two.

From 2018: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC5646220/

"Neuroendocrine disruption by soya isoflavones in mature neuroendocrine systems is by and large reversible with dietary modification and thus, with the exception of some hypersensitive groups such as hypothyroid and oncology patients, soya likely poses no long term health risk and may even confer modest benefits."

Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#125

Post by kipchak »

version_five wrote: post #23
daenz wrote: post #22

Look at the timeline: 1930 - first cigarette company uses physicians in their ads 1950s - evidence starts mounting that smoking causes lung cancer 1964 - US Surgeon General report on the link between smoking and cancer 1998 - cigarette companies still maintained that the link is controversial So it takes 70 years, or nearly an entire generation, before all of the machinery at play (businesses, government, healthcare,…

Yeah who knows what unequivocal advice we could be getting from experts right now that will be thoroughly debunked 70 years from now. (Are dairy and grains still food groups... I could easily go on)

Vegetable/seed oils is one I’ve been seeing recently.

Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#126

Post by champagnois »

tasty_freeze wrote: post #124
champagnois wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

> Soy is poison The concern about soy in infant food is well placed, but your broad statement is hyperbolic. I don't know where you are, but I'm in the US, where 2/3 of adults are overweight, and half of them are obese. Whatever effect soy has on our endocrine systems, it is dwarfed by the effects caused by body fat itself. As for the effect of soy on adults, for most people there is no problem unless they have exces…

I agree with you on all points, but I will say that the thread topic is specifically about headlines 75 years from now rather than what current authorities claim today...

So naturally, every correct answer would be controversial in the present.

The truth eventually wins. It is no soy for my family.

Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#127

Post by simlevesque »

champagnois wrote: post #120
sockaddr wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Question: How do we reconcile "soy is poison" with the fact that some cultures include massive amounts of soy in their diet with little known detriment? For instance, the Japanese seem to eat tons of the stuff in various forms all the time but they seem to lead healthy lives. I don't have any skin in the game, just curious.

Asian cultures are aware. In China for example, tofu is one of the cheapest possible protein sources (think in terms of a massive pallet of it sold for five dollars) but people are generally aware that it is poisonous in some weird ways that won't kill you. Males are generally urged not to consume it. This could be a knowledge of just the upper class, though. An unspoken suggestion to leave the tofu and soy for the p…

So it's all a big conspiracy of the elite against the masses ?

Re: When cigarette companies used doctors to push smoking (2018)

#130

Post by fomine3 »

champagnois wrote: post #123
30002926 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know this?

Chinese family. Have lived there and among chinese elite for most of my life.

Not true in Japan. Everyone eat soy based foods like tofu without worrying.
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