Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired • Hacker News Board

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#121

Post by realreality » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:20 PM UTC

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #99

cletus wrote: post #46

What I find sad about this is how many who seem to be against it were just recently so in favour of private business autonomy [1]. No one's rights are being violated here. If you don't want to get vaccinated, you can. But those choices come with consequences, like just about every other choice we make. It's worth noting that fully remote people won't fall under this policy (from my reading of it anyway) so this isn't…

My Dad has a big divot out of his arm from the vaccine gun when he joined the army. Everyone got a vaccine and that is how it was because the decision was science-based and not up for discussion. Same for when I went to school. Kid not vaccinated? You aren’t going to school. Somehow that got eroded by madness.

> science-based and not up for discussion

You realize this is a contradiction, right?

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#122

Post by motohagiography » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:20 PM UTC

cletus wrote: post #46

What I find sad about this is how many who seem to be against it were just recently so in favour of private business autonomy [1]. No one's rights are being violated here. If you don't want to get vaccinated, you can. But those choices come with consequences, like just about every other choice we make. It's worth noting that fully remote people won't fall under this policy (from my reading of it anyway) so this isn't…

The quality of the reasoning in these above opinions is a useful example of not believing in the standard of logic, consistency, or truth - technically nihilism of the most banal kind. A choice on the condition of consequences is not free or a choice. This deflection of responsibility by the company providing the "choice" is pure gaslighting, and the sadistic glee with which people repeat these slogans should be indicative of who you are dealing with.

It's very close to what is called Hobson's Choice (take it or leave it, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Hobson's%20choice..., but it's really closer to Harvey's (Weinstein's) Bargain, where you are free to join him or not and if you don't, the part goes to someone else. It's not quite a quid-pro-quo, as the threat is to take something from you that you already have.

Companies appear free to offer Hobson's Choice, except they haven't been up until now, and the pandemic narrative has provided air cover for a political purity purge. Anyone who is sceptical of the internal passport system the vax is being used to implement probably isn't a culture fit at a platform company anyway, and they should talk to an employment lawyer about their options for getting a settlement for constructive dismissal.

Otherwise, you can't argue with a nihilist position, as it uses discourse to filter people through a lens of alignment to power and narrative, and has no interest in reconciling to truth.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#123

Post by titzer » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:21 PM UTC

kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #88

titzer wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those places are not, for example, shopping malls.

Pretty sure they have shops there, as well. However, the people stocking the shops probably put on some clothes when they need to venture outside to get supplies.

Well I have never witnessed a mythical naked shopping mall, just some outdoor parks and gardens out away from most other people where only the clued-in would go. It is not ok to go out naked in public!

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#124

Post by postsantum » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:22 PM UTC

barney54 wrote: post #23

CabSauce wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the rights of a private (in the sense of government) company to make their own decisions?

Google is free to set their rules and we are free to complain about them.

Google is overstepping their bounds the same way Nasim Aghdam overstepped bounds of complaining about Google

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#125

Post by srean » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:22 PM UTC

astura wrote: post #120

srean wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you been this upset all this while at the fact that international students have been required to take a bunch of different vaccines as a prerequisite for admission in US colleges ? You may have been, I don't know.

In fact, in my state all students , international or not, are required tot take a bunch of different vaccines before they are allowed to attend classes. My friend started college in his late 30s and didn't have access to his childhood immunizations since it was so long ago. He had to get a blood test showing immunity before he could attend class.

For transmissible diseases that's an excellent call.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#126

Post by ethbr0 » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:25 PM UTC

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #99

cletus wrote: post #46

What I find sad about this is how many who seem to be against it were just recently so in favour of private business autonomy [1]. No one's rights are being violated here. If you don't want to get vaccinated, you can. But those choices come with consequences, like just about every other choice we make. It's worth noting that fully remote people won't fall under this policy (from my reading of it anyway) so this isn't…

My Dad has a big divot out of his arm from the vaccine gun when he joined the army. Everyone got a vaccine and that is how it was because the decision was science-based and not up for discussion. Same for when I went to school. Kid not vaccinated? You aren’t going to school. Somehow that got eroded by madness.

My dad told me about getting his polio vaccination during the public health drives of the 1960s. They did an entire grade school in a single day. And there were parents who were furious about it at the time. No progress happens without protest.

But personally, I'm pretty damn thankful for their sacrifice so that we live in a largely polio-free world today.

I'm not sure when "what you can do for your country" got so small that people aren't willing to take the minuscule risk of vaccination side effects in order to gift the substantial benefit to their neighbors. Used to be, selfishness like that made you an asshole.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#127

Post by quantified » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

eldaisfish wrote: post #60

DiffEq wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then why not fire people who are overweight? That kills more people; reduces work capacity more than any other, and costs more money than any other health issue we have. Additionally, if you are healthy and do not have the comorbidities that come with being overweight your risks of being a Covid mortality is less than the flu. So to be consistent Google should fire everyone that is overweight right? And you should be…

Weight-related diseases are generally not communicable, and are certainly not airborne. My risk of vehicular injury is not increased by being around you, even if you are a bad driver.

Part of being bad is being more dangerous to others- how solid are your stats?

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#128

Post by ethbr0 » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

realreality wrote: post #121

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My Dad has a big divot out of his arm from the vaccine gun when he joined the army. Everyone got a vaccine and that is how it was because the decision was science-based and not up for discussion. Same for when I went to school. Kid not vaccinated? You aren’t going to school. Somehow that got eroded by madness.

> science-based and not up for discussion You realize this is a contradiction, right?

Science can be conclusive.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#129

Post by chrisoverzero » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:27 PM UTC

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #72

chrisoverzero wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Only 28% of black people in New York are vaccinated […] This is not what the article you’ve cited says.

Whoops - It said young (whatever that means) as an adjective. I'll edit that in.

It means 18 to 44, according to the article.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#130

Post by Karsteski » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:29 PM UTC

chrisseaton wrote: post #105

Karsteski wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should companies also require their employees not be overweight because they are less likely to miss work due to illness?

I don't think weight is a protected category, so yes this is fine. For example insurers will discriminate based on weight. The military discriminates based on weight. Hooters discriminates based on weight. Etc.

Well I hope we don't end up in such a world. Even if I personally won't be affected negatively. Sounds incredibly distopian.