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The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

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Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#121

Post by claviska »

helloguillecl wrote: post #8

This is absurd. Even in a country with liberal economics and "free choice" health system (however with universal care, and state regulation), the same stitches in a world-class private clinic in Santiago, Chile would cost 400 USD, before insurance . The clinics there are not the ones Americans imagine from a middle-income country, most of them have better infrastructure and doctors than the ones I know in Europe. And…

My wife and her family are from Peru. It’s not uncommon for our relatives that are living in the U.S. to fly back to Peru and pay cash for procedures instead of doing it through their U.S. insurance.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#123

Post by _puk »

iso1210 wrote: post #61

I had a gout flareup while in Washington DC for work. It's happened before, last time (in the UK) I phoned up the freephone national number for advice, my wife drove me to the local hospital, I walked (hobbled) in, had a couple of tests, was given some tablets and a presecription, and left in 15 minutes. That cost about $1.50 in gas parking would have cost another $5, but it was the weekend and parking was free. The…

"The prescription was $12 (standard price in the UK for any prescription drug or drugs, no matter what it is)"

Just to note, in Wales all prescriptions are free. Can't speak for Scotland / NI.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#124

Post by [deleted] »

watwut wrote: post #31
HPsquared wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The stitches are expensive mostly because of many regulatory factors that restrict the supply of medical services and drive costs up, with the "free market" component being in how much they can charge the patients. It's the worst of both worlds in the US.

Regulatory factors exists in all mentioned countries. Medical services being restricted is not some kind of exception.

[deleted]

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#125

Post by ElDji »

trixie_ wrote: post #116
helloguillecl wrote: post #8

This is absurd. Even in a country with liberal economics and "free choice" health system (however with universal care, and state regulation), the same stitches in a world-class private clinic in Santiago, Chile would cost 400 USD, before insurance . The clinics there are not the ones Americans imagine from a middle-income country, most of them have better infrastructure and doctors than the ones I know in Europe. And…

Free market works fine, unfortunately like tuition prices the government got involved and prevented what the free market is good at and driving down prices. Fortunately now there a new price transparency laws which the full the effects haven’t been felt yet and are a step in the right direction.

When free market doesn't work, free market advocates have their solution : there wasn't enough free market, so we need MORE free market.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#126

Post by Hakashiro »

I always find interesting to read these stories because nowhere else but the US can you make over 300k USD a year as a senior engineer of some kind. In Europe, 200k EUR is already ridiculous, and most countries take away half your salary in taxes anyway so...

Would you rather make 300k and pay 4k for the occasional ER visit or make 50k after tax and pay 100 for the occasional ER visit?

I suppose this comment will get buried in downvotes, but do not ever forget that American engineers are the best paid workers in the entire world.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#127

Post by RobertoG »

donatj wrote: post #75
smabie wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who are these people? Where are they? Not really convinced they exist.

They don’t exist. They’re the imagined scapegoat for what is actually just a much harder to comprehend creeping bureaucracy cost. The human mind loves clear enemies but Hanlon’s Razor almost always applies. Almost no one ever actually has malicious intent, but our brain evolved to watch for enemies and loves seeing patterns where they aren’t.

The USA expenditure in healthcare per capita is, more or less, the double that the Netherlands (1) and doesn't cover all the population. Where the difference goes?

Sorry if some of us, in our biased minds, suspect that some of that money is spent in cigars and expensive suits.

(1) - https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.XPD.CHEX.PC.CD?most_...

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#128

Post by rostigerpudel »

helloguillecl wrote: post #67
nisa wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? As long as you are not private insured - which is not difficult to do usally - if you have a job you are insured (a percentage of your pay is used for insurance, if you study you are insured (90 eur) or you can join on your own for 200eur/month depending on your income if you are working on your own. You pay nothing for ER, 10eur/day for the hospital and a few eur for medication - but noth…

Did you actually read my comments in this conversation? Are you aware that in Germany clinics have different prices than the ones you pay after insurance? I have always talked about prices before insurance , which is what I'm arguing looks completely out of place. I'm public insured in Germany and no, dental is not really covered, I had to pay my routine treatment last time at the praxis, and it was not cheap. Do you…

Yes, the price before insurance is generally higher, but reguated by the public insurance. See one of the price catalogs here: https://www.g-drg.de/aG-DRG-System_2021/Fallpauschalen-Katal...

You do not need to pay extra for dental if you choose the most basic treatment. Most people like their dental work to look like their natural teeth which does not count as most basic. That is why you had to pay, but only the price difference to the basic treatment.

And, of course, the doc likes to sell you some extra treatment (say "professional tooth cleaning") which will make her/him some extra money.

Same for glasses. The most basic option is free. If you don't like the coke bottle bottoms then you will have to cover the difference yourself.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#129

Post by jjoonathan »

trixie_ wrote: post #116
helloguillecl wrote: post #8

This is absurd. Even in a country with liberal economics and "free choice" health system (however with universal care, and state regulation), the same stitches in a world-class private clinic in Santiago, Chile would cost 400 USD, before insurance . The clinics there are not the ones Americans imagine from a middle-income country, most of them have better infrastructure and doctors than the ones I know in Europe. And…

Free market works fine, unfortunately like tuition prices the government got involved and prevented what the free market is good at and driving down prices. Fortunately now there a new price transparency laws which the full the effects haven’t been felt yet and are a step in the right direction.

Our mostly private health care system is twice as expensive as the social systems in other developed countries because the government got involved?

By what fraction will the new set of tweaks have to shrink costs to pay for the last 30 years of the private health care market's failure to deliver on its "more efficient" promise? Remember, it has to cut them by 50% just to break even, and it'll have to go further to make this experiment worthwhile. A lot further.

Spoiler alert: it won't even get to 50%. It won't even get close to 50%.

Re: The ER charged him $6,589.77 for 6 stitches, cost that led his wife to avoid ER

#130

Post by [deleted] »

jonplackett wrote: post #53

Why is the discussion in America always private VS nationalised healthcare instead of just making private healthcare value for money / less insane. Here in the UK we have the NHS which is great. But we ALSO have private insurance / hospitals / healthcare that is reasonably priced.

[deleted]
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