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Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

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121–130 of 400 posts

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#121
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

I think you'll want to talk to Apple first.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#122
post #36
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

Why is it desirable for Congress to make laws limiting how electronics manufacturers can design their electronics? If Facebook wants to make a VR headset that requires that you upload a monthly video of you doing the chicken dance, just don’t buy their product. Attempting to use government to make private entities build the kinds of technology you like is a pretty heavy hammer to drop on individual freedoms.

Because the market is imperfect. There is a profound information asymmetry between the consumer and the purveyor of high-tech products, and this asymmetry is exploited to raise the price of the product, in secret, without customer consent.

This is, of course, fraud. Why doesn't current law apply? I think it does. But courts are funny: when fraud becomes common and accepted, and people cease to recognize it as fraud, it becomes acceptable. In those cases, a new law is reasonable.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#123
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

Peripheral might be complicated.

But I would like to see such a legislation for anything that is Turing-complete and sufficiently performant (e.g. can run Doom at 800x600 32bpp 60FPS).

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#124

Stuff like this is great fun, but if we just don't buy things from known bad actors in the first place, we can save ourselves the trouble of playing whack-a-mole.

This would be great if there was any hope to see a better actor coming in. Currently buying a Quest 2 equivalent from a "good" actor is just thought exercise.

Looking at Vive, they don't seem ready to enter the regular consumer market anytime soon. Google and Samsung threw the towel long ago. I'm not sure Microsoft could be a better actor than Facebook if they wanted to (remember it all came down on us way after the devices were sold).

Then chances are Facebook would also kill any incoming competitor in the egg.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#125
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

I hate to break it to you, but Logitech now runs always-on ‘Cloud Settings’ sync and telemetry software called Logi Options. It comes with a way to use a mouse across devices seamlessly (Flow) which requires low-level networking permissions and a daemon on all participating devices. It’s not required that you have an account or even use the software, but of course they actively push all of the above and require it to…

> It’s not required that you have an account or even use the software

That's the key point. The fact that some people weren't even able to use their Oculus device when FB went down for hours is insane. Imagine not being able to use your mouse or keyboard because Logitech went down.

There's a very big difference between an optional cloud system that brings convenience (settings sync) vs a required cloud system that the device cannot be used without.

From my understanding, the comment about was specifically trying to write regulation against the latter.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#126
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

Why bother specifying hardware? No, thank you, I have no desire to have a cloud account for my purely offline software either.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#127
post #7

Why not HTC Vive though? Better development, better privacy, more game support.

> more game support

Is that true? From my understanding, Oculus has exclusive games, as well as supporting all open games, so Oculus basically supports all Vive games + a bunch of exclusives Vive doesn't. What games do Vive support that Oculus doesn't?

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#128
post #76
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was said about phones 10 years ago, and electricity 100 years before that.

I was being flippant in my comment above, but just to be clear: I think regulating business models for cell phones is just as bad an idea. Electrical service has limitations around things like termination of service / fair pricing / safety, but we don’t mandate how they design their software and servers.

> I think regulating business models for cell phones is just as bad an idea.

I mean, we can mandate minimum services. Something that has a webbrowser, email client, texts and calls. If you want to say that apps don't fit into that, I suppose that works.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#129
post #15

Facebook keeps asking Congress to make laws. How about this one: Peripherals, including mice, monitors, keyboards, VR headsets or any other device used to process input or output from a computer, may NOT be connected to any cloud service with an account. Any such cloud connections MUST be for software updates only and software updates MUST be capable of permanent opt-out without any loss of usage. I mean I grew up wi…

I hate to break it to you, but Logitech now runs always-on ‘Cloud Settings’ sync and telemetry software called Logi Options. It comes with a way to use a mouse across devices seamlessly (Flow) which requires low-level networking permissions and a daemon on all participating devices. It’s not required that you have an account or even use the software, but of course they actively push all of the above and require it to…

Razer is even worse than a mandatory account. When you connect a Razer device (including changing the port it's plugged into), Windows will try to execute the Razer software installer. It's really annoying.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#130
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I spend $50,000 on a tractor that also has a cloud component that drives the tractor around for me, is it also not fair to expect that I can use that tractor just as a tractor if I don't have internet access at my farm? It's a different story if it's eg. an Alexa device thats primary purpose is to be connected to the internet. If a device is in a class of product that doesn't necessarily need a cloud connection/ac…

If when you bought the tractor, the tractor company said “this tractor requires that you have internet access and keep the tractor online”, and you bought it, then no, it’s not fair of you to expect to just disregard that. Now, if you want to take a screwdriver and serial cable to the tractor and hack the crap out it, and you manage to bypass the requirement, have at it. You own the tractor. They can feel free to voi…

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