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Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

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Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#121

Post by tobylane »

glassx wrote: post #88
technomancy wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How open is Honeycomb, or Ice Cream? Do you have any idea how much crap they are getting for that? People made a stink, and they learned their lesson.

And it's a cool thing. I hope Apple learns their lesson too, with articles like this. My guess is that, in both cases (Honeycomb and FaceTime), it was more a problem of corporate inertia or laziness rather than evil.

Sounds evil to deliberately allow anyone to see the 2.x source but not the 3.x which is only a continuation, not a rewrite.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#122

Post by yardie »

JoachimSchipper wrote: post #116
ChuckMcM wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It took me too long to figure this out. There are some people to truly, and passionately, believe something they say to you, and realistically they personally can't make it happen so you can't really bank on that 'promise.' I used to think those people were lying to take advantage, but as I've gotten older I have come to recognize that these 'yes' people get promoted a lot. And for some of them, they really do believ…

Good point in general, but Jobs can "personally make it happen".

Unless Jobs personally wrote the stack in Facetime all I can think of is patents, patents, patents.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#123

Post by yardie »

rdl wrote: post #28

I might care more if I'd ever actually observed someone using FaceTime. I have 3 MacBooks, an iPad, an iPhone 4, my coworkers and girlfriend and friends have FaceTime compatible devices too, but I've never seen anyone use it. Maybe they don't open it because it is a dead product.

They don't use it probably because it's too damn hard to find. From the Mac, Facetime is another app, double-click in your dock or application folder. From the iphone, not nearly as simple. First you have to open the phone app then select a contact, then select Facetime.

Unlike Skype, you have no indication that this person has a facetime compatible phone. Just to get it to call the desktop is problematic because my phone has my phone number as the username and my PC has my email as the username so your never sure where a facetime call is going to end up, and that is if it picks up.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#124

Post by gizzlon »

ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

Of course he sometimes lies.. duh! Of course he will say whatever they believe will maximize profit. Often this means telling the truth (kind of), sometimes not.

But I agree the article is underwhelming. I wish someone would compile a list of the best lies Apple (and other companies) have told the last decade.. would be entertaining.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#125

Post by Hov »

I think people are taking issue solely with this particular case. Perhaps in this particular instance one could make a weak argument that Steve Jobs didn't lie. That's fine. But the headline as a generality is obviously true. Everybody lies, including Steve Jobs.

A recent lie is the whole "TweetDeck are having a nightmare dealing with Android fragmentation" comment for example. Or going further back, the little Woz "business deal" of old or even the G5 benchmark controversy.

We all lie. No need to defend Jobs at all.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#126

Post by trezor »

joshaidan wrote: post #105

Reading this makes me think of the iPhone commercial about FaceTime. http://youtu.be/EmAIptWS7Mk "If you don't have an iPhone, you don't have FaceTime on your phone." Perhaps it was the marketing department that was not informed of Steve's intentions to open up the FaceTime protocol, or maybe Apple really has changed their position on opening up the protocol. I really wish they would open up the protocol. It would be…

And just think, all these android users would have to get iTunes accounts.

I don't think you will find a international standards-body which will standardize anything which requires an iTunes account. I may be wrong, but I sure as hell hope not.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#127

Post by jamesteow »

funthree wrote: post #82
ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

You lied. You said something that turned out to be a lie (an inaccurate or false statement) and although people have trouble hearing the word, it doesn't make it any less true. You do not fit a few of the definitions of "lie" but you fit at least one. edit: to all the downvoters, pick up a dictionary

If someone asks me a question, I give them an answer based on my understanding, and it turns out not to be so, I am not lying. At the time, I thought it was to be so.

By going along a strict definition of a lie being "an inaccurate or false statement," I think it is misleading especially compared to the other definitions: "a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood" or "something intended or serving to convey a false impression;"

These other definitions relate to intent, which is a factor in determining whether a statement is a lie or not.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#128

Post by LiveTheDream »

funthree wrote: post #82
ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

You lied. You said something that turned out to be a lie (an inaccurate or false statement) and although people have trouble hearing the word, it doesn't make it any less true. You do not fit a few of the definitions of "lie" but you fit at least one. edit: to all the downvoters, pick up a dictionary

lie: An intentionally false statement.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#129

Post by joshaidan »

trezor wrote: post #126
joshaidan wrote: post #105

Reading this makes me think of the iPhone commercial about FaceTime. http://youtu.be/EmAIptWS7Mk "If you don't have an iPhone, you don't have FaceTime on your phone." Perhaps it was the marketing department that was not informed of Steve's intentions to open up the FaceTime protocol, or maybe Apple really has changed their position on opening up the protocol. I really wish they would open up the protocol. It would be…

And just think, all these android users would have to get iTunes accounts. I don't think you will find a international standards-body which will standardize anything which requires an iTunes account. I may be wrong, but I sure as hell hope not.

True, but I wonder if Apple really needs to have a standards body overseeing it. They can still open up the protocol without going through a standards body, which is probably in their best interest.

Then third party developers would develop FaceTime apps for Android, etc.

But then of course you won't get the seamless user experience.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#130

Post by pedalpete »

yardie wrote: post #122
JoachimSchipper wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good point in general, but Jobs can "personally make it happen".

Unless Jobs personally wrote the stack in Facetime all I can think of is patents, patents, patents.

but I assume you are speaking of those 'patents, patents, patents' being owned by Apple. If so, Apple can open the standard and still own the patents.

If others own the patents, Apple can still open Facetime with the requirement the anybody who wants to use it has to go to the patent holders before it can be made into a product.

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