We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments • Hacker News Board

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#121

Post by __sy__ » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:30 PM UTC

minsc__and__boo wrote: post #106

__sy__ wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Whether the prior occupant or the property management company has extra sets of keys, you generally don't want some random prospective tenant out there to have the keys to a unit that you will eventually want to rent out to another individual. For Airbnb's/STR's, same problem; guests returning to a unit much later to carry out illegal activities is rather well documented at this point. Across the board, i…

Yep. Bad actors will still find a way circumvent the system, either by copying keys or other means. It's a matter of risk and liability mitigation, not prevention. I'd be curious to know if you're building a reputation system for renters/rentees (users), since that would provide value in such a market to fight it.

We are not. This is mostly because we are an infrastructure company that takes care of bridging the air-gap between the devices out there and the software applications that want to use them. Whether the locks are used for hospitality, self-storage access, or rentals is somewhat dependent on the context, and there's a lot of complexity that is unique to each vertical. We think our (beta) customers do a better job at this than we could.

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#122

Post by einpoklum » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:33 PM UTC

an_opabinia wrote: post #76

literallycancer wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the landlords just make the rent more expensive to account for having to pay the broker, what changed?

> So the landlords just make the rent more expensive to account for having to pay the broker, what changed? Nothing. Clearly brokers are doing something or else people wouldn't pay for them. My theory is the broker fee has positive selection for wealthier tenants, which for every property - low or high rent - makes for an economically better tenant. Raising the rent has the same effect. We care that there's cheap ren…

> Clearly brokers are doing something or else people wouldn't pay for them.

In many cases (not talking about NYC here), what they're doing is simply blocking access to an apartment. You see an apartment, you have to deal with the broker / real-estate agent / makelaar. Or - you don't even see it in the first place, since it's only available via an agency.

This is similar to setting up a roadblock and collecting a transit tax; or the "troll under the bridge" from folk tales.

That being said - In some cases and some places brokers can help apartment seekers filter relevant apartments, and can help convince both the seeker and the landlord to compromise, agree to some arrangements to seal the deal. Another benefit of such type of apartment brokerage is that a broker with a minimum of reputation would not try to scam you (rent contract scams are a thing in some countries); and may be able to exert some pressure if, say, some serious problem is revealed right after you move in and the landlord doesn't want to address it.

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#123

Post by __sy__ » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:33 PM UTC

dempsey wrote: post #105

__sy__ wrote: post #37

We started Seam (YC S20) a year ago to take on the problem of programmatic access to physical spaces (apartments, single-family homes, commercial buildings...etc). Basically one API that can open any door (smart locks, elevators, commercial buildings...etc). We're still in private beta but feel free to reach out if you're struggling with programmatic access. tbh, it's baffling that in 2021, this problem is still so d…

I know very large REITs that use Kwikset Smart Keys. They have a dozen keys and just reset to a different of the dozen after every move out. Tens of thousands of homes and never had a problem. It’s security through obscurity. Plus locks are easy to break/bypass for someone that’s motivated to do so. It’s the casual crime of opportunity that you can guard against.

Are you referring to smart locks with unique codes or the Kwikset solution that consists of pulling out the cylinder and putting a new one in?

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#124

Post by bredren » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:35 PM UTC

d33lio wrote: post #74

cde-v wrote: post #6

Would love something like this to kill (or at least severely maim) the broker industry in NYC. 0 value added at the cost of 10-15% of yearly rent.

It's a huge hassle in Boston as well. Pretty boy hustle brokers deserve easy work that doesn't require real education so I can pay more to find a domicile - said no one ever...

Had to deal with this in Boston back in 2007. Some bro driving me around. Took this massive fee. Made no sense.

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#125

Post by einpoklum » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:36 PM UTC

tut-urut-utut wrote: post #40

literallycancer wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the landlords just make the rent more expensive to account for having to pay the broker, what changed?

The rent price depends on supply and demand, not on landlords costs.

That's like saying rent prices depend on the will of god. Retroactively, you can justify this claim regardless of what happened: "It was god's will" or "You had to adapt your price to the demand".

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#126

Post by dangerwill » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:36 PM UTC

__sy__ wrote: post #83

dangerwill wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of logistical headaches, what happens with your system when the power goes out in a building?

Right now we have a multi-protocol hub with cellular and battery back-up. So the short answer is... nothing?

Nothing until the battery runs out. I'm just thinking of situations like Texas, the East Coast hurricane season, the West Coast fire season, etc where power cuts can last up to a week.

Or what happens when GCP/AWS/Azure have a bad day and you lose connectivity with your API servers?

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#127

Post by dave5104 » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:36 PM UTC

mschuster91 wrote: post #34

Landlords being able to require proof of no evictions in rent history makes sense (even though it absolutely makes life worse for people who fell on any form of hardship), but why are landlords even allowed to demand proof of no felonies?!

> but why are landlords even allowed to demand proof of no felonies?!

As someone who has worked on tenant screening software, landlords typically care about a criminal history involving sex offenses or drug manufacturing. In case of recidivism, the former creates liability from other tenants if issues arise during tenancy, and the latter has potential for property destruction and/or harm to neighboring units.

There are also typically time limits on how far "back" they can look, typically 5-7 years at the most.

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#128

Post by rsj_hn » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

TillE wrote: post #60

mushufasa wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

0 value added for the tenant, but brokers typically serve the landlord.

I don't really get where brokers fit in. Most landlords should have the time/employees to take care of such things themselves. An absentee landlord would need a whole property management service to take care of everything, not just one small part. Brokers should be a niche service at best.

> Most landlords should have the time/employees to take care of such things themselves.

Do they have to have their own fulltime electrician on staff or are they allowed to contract it out? Why the insistence that the work be done by their own employees instead of contractors?

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#129

Post by e1g » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

benmanns wrote: post #111

We used this pre-COVID to get out of a Brooklyn lease and had a fantastic experience (back when it was Flip Instant). Flip basically charged 1 month rent and guaranteed a fill or they'd pay the rest (6 months) of my lease. Compared to our landlord who wanted 1.75x rent, up to 2.75x rent if not filled immediately, after significant negotiation. Hiring a broker myself would have likely cost 1x rent or more anyways with…

The landlord is under no obligation to accept anyone this service finds, so this startup guarantees an outcome they cannot control. It might be a way to build awareness and goodwill, but they are burning VC capital to offer a service that is either fundamentally unsustainable or mispriced.

Re: We replaced rental brokers with software and filled 200 vacant apartments

#130

Post by closeparen » Thu, Jul 08, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

The big question in San Francisco is “what does the parking cost?” Very few complexes disclose this; you must give a human your name, number, and expected move date before they will say. It’s a scummy, car dealership-like experience. I would love for stuff like this to be online but the fact is savvy landlords with very high quality websites withhold it intentionally, in order to start a human relationship.