It seems the tobacco industry had more luck with their scientific advisors.
Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
121–130 of 864 posts
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#122It's pretty important to get this story straight: She moved files when she wasn't supposed to. This seems like a pretty standard firing. People are already claiming on twitter that Google is assaulting ethical AI, and I just don't see it. Google did not immediately comment on those claims. Its statement said of Mitchell: “We confirmed that there were multiple violations of our code of conduct, as well as of our secur…
>She moved files when she wasn't supposed to If that's true, that's not very ethical is it?
You always have to be careful with people who do bad things for "good" reasons (ie the difference between Sci-Hub and reselling pirated papers for a profit).
You want a gulf of difference between the punishment for nefarious activity and the punishment for well-intended-but-unlawful activity.
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#123It's pretty important to get this story straight: She moved files when she wasn't supposed to. This seems like a pretty standard firing. People are already claiming on twitter that Google is assaulting ethical AI, and I just don't see it. Google did not immediately comment on those claims. Its statement said of Mitchell: “We confirmed that there were multiple violations of our code of conduct, as well as of our secur…
> She moved files when she wasn't supposed to.
According to Google.
Remember, an entity that has a reason and a justification to do what it wants will manufacture whatever evidence it needs to do that.
And, it's not a court of law. At best, it's "allegedly moved files when they weren't supposed to".
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#124- 135,000 Google employees - 2,000 signed a petition to support Timnit [1] - 2 employees resigned to support Timnit [2] When it comes to voting with your feet, no one actually gives a shit. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/04/thousands-petition-google-fo... [2] https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/04/tech/google-employees-quit/in...
This is something I feel like few people learn in life in the US. You may be morally right, but nobody ever has your back. The few that do you can probably call friends, but the many that don't will never lift a finger to help you legitimately when it matters.
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Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#125I'm not interested in the details of this, but from a distance - people sure do make life difficult for themselves, bringing politics and their opinions and controversy into workplaces. It's always tech and academia, too - you'd think it'd be enough to get just paid shitloads of money for interesting knowledge work and save the drama for friends in the pub (or the bar, or whatever).
It's impossible to work on the ethics of AI without involving politics.
Maybe it doesn't need to be quite so married to one particular set of politics.
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#126- 135,000 Google employees
- 2,000 signed a petition to support Timnit [1]
- 2 employees resigned to support Timnit [2]
When it comes to voting with your feet, no one actually gives a shit.
[1] https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/04/thousands-petition-google-fo...
[2] https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/04/tech/google-employees-quit/in...
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#127- 135,000 Google employees - 2,000 signed a petition to support Timnit [1] - 2 employees resigned to support Timnit [2] When it comes to voting with your feet, no one actually gives a shit. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/04/thousands-petition-google-fo... [2] https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/04/tech/google-employees-quit/in...
How is Google in the wrong exactly?
Gebru was fired because she gave an ultimatum to her boss threatening to resign if they don't disclose names of all reviewers who criticized her work AND blasted group emails calling for sabotage https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f2kYWDXwhzYnq8ebVtuk9CqQ...
Mitchell was fired for exfiltrating thousands of files illegally and sending to external accounts https://venturebeat.com/2021/01/20/google-targets-ai-ethics-...
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#128> Mitchell has been locked out of the corporate email since last month after what a source says was her effort to search corporate correspondence for evidence to back up Gebru's claim of discrimination and harassment It sounds like she dredged through her email, and sent emails she found to an ex-employee. That's probably going to get you fired.
It seems to me like there is no possible situation where searching (dredged is a weirdly loaded word) through ones own email is a fire able offense. In fact, the idea that one can be fired for reading ones own work email strikes me as kind of absurd and unworkable.
Perhaps there are things one can do with the emails you found that are fireable, that’s beyond my (lack of) legal expertise, but searching? That doesn’t seem right.
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#129It seems the tobacco industry had more luck with their scientific advisors.
Well, the problem with hiring an Ethics specialist will tend to be that they already have a strong ethical compass.
Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
Or they'll just conclude the whole thing was a waste and only caused negative publicity and hard feelings and have legal and PR and relevant stakeholders from any given project manage ethics going forward like normal BigCos do.
Let's be real. The whole idea of this "Ethics Board" was only ever done for PR. Period. Google never actually intended to follow through with any of their recommendations if it meant going against its financial interests.
> The whole idea of this "Ethics Board" was only ever done for PR
Probably, but this also means that they didn't hire the best people for the job, just the people who would have looked better in the position.