Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

justice.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 242 posts

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#121

Post by gonehome »

tehjoker wrote: post #101
gonehome wrote: post #58

So much for “Zoom is committed to supporting the open exchange of ideas and conversations” - it was clear this was nonsense when they said it, but the stuff alleged here is way worse than even I would have predicted. These people are awful - Zoom should be avoided (along probably with any company operating primarily out of China, under influence of the CCP). https://zalberico.com/essay/2020/06/13/zoom-in-china.html

If you think companies operating under the influence of the USG are better you've got another thing coming. EDIT: I like that whenever I post something negative about the USG in an anti-China thread, I go to -4 then bounce up later. It could be people are really that nationalistic. Who knows.

It’s not nationalism - it’s rejecting knee-jerk false equivalence. It’s downvoted because it usually comes up immediately and just isn’t true.

I say this as someone who would have made similar knee-jerk comments when I was 18 so I have some understanding of where they come from.

Believing the behavior of all governments is equivalently bad makes you a mark for bad governments (which want you to believe that).

The USG isn’t without fault, but it’s a far cry from the actions of the CCP.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24888552

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24887606

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#122

Post by ipnon »

kemitchell wrote: post #116
ipnon wrote: post #20

As alleged, the defendant was an active agent of the CCP and PRC intelligence[a] working inside an American company to deny the rights of freedom of speech and religion to residents of America.[b] The PRC is willfully breaking American law to disenfranchise Americans of their constitutional rights. [a] “The allegations in the complaint lay bare the Faustian bargain that the PRC government demands of U.S. technology c…

Those are the allegations, or at least quotes from the press release announcing the charges. But nothing has been proved yet. Jin's innocent until proven otherwise, though they may yet prove otherwise. I don't mean to pick on you. As someone who works in legal---albeit not in criminal law---citing a complaint as fact, when it's essentially one side's declaration of what they intend to prove, does bother me.

I edited my comment to make it clear these are allegations.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#123

Post by Aarostotle »

tehjoker wrote: post #101
gonehome wrote: post #58

So much for “Zoom is committed to supporting the open exchange of ideas and conversations” - it was clear this was nonsense when they said it, but the stuff alleged here is way worse than even I would have predicted. These people are awful - Zoom should be avoided (along probably with any company operating primarily out of China, under influence of the CCP). https://zalberico.com/essay/2020/06/13/zoom-in-china.html

If you think companies operating under the influence of the USG are better you've got another thing coming. EDIT: I like that whenever I post something negative about the USG in an anti-China thread, I go to -4 then bounce up later. It could be people are really that nationalistic. Who knows.

No, it’s just apples and oranges. The USA is a flawed constitutional republic that runs on a messy democratic process. It’s ugly sometimes, but it’s fundamentally good.

The PRC is something else.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#124

Post by dx87 »

unityByFreedom wrote: post #118
hyperrail wrote: post #105

Here's Zoom's own public statement on the matter: https://blog.zoom.us/our-perspective-on-the-doj-complaint/ The statement also says that Zoom itself is under separate US federal investigations for its dealings with Chinese and other foreign governments, as well as its security and privacy practices more generally.

In the bit about the "now-former employee", it sounds like they admit they banned accounts hosting meetings about Tiananmen Square. > During the time this individual was employed by Zoom, he took actions resulting in the termination of several meetings in remembrance of Tiananmen Square and meetings involving religious and/or political activities, some of which were hosted by non-China-based users. We terminated the…

IIRC, the banning accounts part isn't new info. They were called out for it and I think their reasoning was that at the time they didn't have a way to just block certain regions from a meeting, so they banned the meetings altogether because people from China were joining them, and they wanted to stay on the CCPs good side.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#125

Post by yogue »

The litmus test, IMHO, should be if any other American competitors of Zoom - viz. Google Meet, FaceTime, Teams, fb Messenger rooms etc. - are getting charged for similar activities? If not, then it may be worth questioning if Zoom is really as “American” or “non-Chinese” as it claims to be!

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#128

Post by wbl »

dx87 wrote: post #124
unityByFreedom wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the bit about the "now-former employee", it sounds like they admit they banned accounts hosting meetings about Tiananmen Square. > During the time this individual was employed by Zoom, he took actions resulting in the termination of several meetings in remembrance of Tiananmen Square and meetings involving religious and/or political activities, some of which were hosted by non-China-based users. We terminated the…

IIRC, the banning accounts part isn't new info. They were called out for it and I think their reasoning was that at the time they didn't have a way to just block certain regions from a meeting, so they banned the meetings altogether because people from China were joining them, and they wanted to stay on the CCPs good side.

This indictment shows that was a pack of lies. This wasn't corporate policy working through regular channels.

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#129

Post by camdenlock »

octoberfranklin wrote: post #110
camdenlock wrote: post #102

Are these sorts of investigations and revelations going to disappear now that the Democratic Party has been elected to power?

It's not a left vs right thing. If Mitch McConnell were Attorney General he would drop the case too. Basically most of our politicians (on both sides) have sold out to China and a very few haven't.

Well that sounds terrifying. Got any sources?

Re: Zoom executive charged with disrupting meetings commemorating Tiananmen Square

#130

Post by peteretep »

pishpash wrote: post #68
sergiotapia wrote: post #8

I will speak with other leaders at my company to move us away from Zoom for conferencing. If you're a leader how can you read this and not only tolerate it, but pay for it? This is it.

What is "it"? This is an allegation. Under an administration with a highly motivated agenda. Could be true, or could be completely fabricated/exaggerated like all the national security allegations this administration has thrown about.

> This is an allegation

I feel dismissing a case that the DOJ is briefing for and that the FBI has added the perpetrator to Most Wanted for as “an allegation” is true in a strict legal sense, but the burden of proof for a commercial decision has been unequivocally reached here

Post reply on HN