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Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

thetyee.ca

121–130 of 204 posts

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#121
To be plain, this sort of clear benefit and experience is what the DEA fights against. Because it is a federal law enforcement agency and not a medical entity, it's focus isn't on serving Americans but preserving the anointed order of the state.

While obvious, the ongoing harm done by ascribing medical responsibilities to an LEO doesn't capture the interest of elected officials. Unless the electorate forces their interest, that won't ever change.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#122
post #112
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I presume the main reason for the controversy is the prevailing dogma "Drugs are evil". This dogma has been used to enact countless bills of legislation in most rich countries, which in turn have encumbered the justice and police system, which in turn have put thousands upon thousands of people into to the correctional system for years. After all that busywork, lives destroyed and taxpayer money wasted, it is really…

>I presume the main reason for the controversy is the prevailing dogma "Drugs are evil". Eh, I think this is too dismissive of some pretty deep ethical and philosophical considerations. Effectively they are giving drugs that alter ones perception of reality and then judging their effectiveness on the patients perspective. But since they alter their perception of reality it's tough to rely on patient reports. Anecdota…

> Anecdotally speaking, there's a lot of people in this world that think drugs make their lives better when an objective observer would pretty strongly disagree.

what does it even mean to "objectively observe" whether drugs make someone's life better? we can look at a crack addict living in squalor and plainly see how their addiction inhibits material success. we can also imagine how deeply unhappy we would be to live in such circumstances. but if we want to know how that individual person experiences their own life, all we can do is ask them.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#123

I don't understand the controversy. We know full well the natural world is full of substances with significant impact on our bodies. Many such substances can even on average be harmful, but when used correctly, they are beneficial. Opioids come to mind first and foremost. It's not controversial to give e.g. serious accident victims a shot of morphine. Why are investigations into medicinal use of shrooms or marijuana…

Agreed. Especially when the current common palliative treatment is to load them up with opiates such that they are asleep, high, or massively in pain and also constipated in the rare lucid moments.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#124
post #20

I don't understand the controversy. We know full well the natural world is full of substances with significant impact on our bodies. Many such substances can even on average be harmful, but when used correctly, they are beneficial. Opioids come to mind first and foremost. It's not controversial to give e.g. serious accident victims a shot of morphine. Why are investigations into medicinal use of shrooms or marijuana…

I presume the main reason for the controversy is the prevailing dogma "Drugs are evil". This dogma has been used to enact countless bills of legislation in most rich countries, which in turn have encumbered the justice and police system, which in turn have put thousands upon thousands of people into to the correctional system for years. After all that busywork, lives destroyed and taxpayer money wasted, it is really…

This doesn't really address their point that opioids are somehow accepted in the public eye as a legitimate medicine but other drugs with both recreational and medical uses are not

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#125
post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I presume the main reason for the controversy is the prevailing dogma "Drugs are evil". Eh, I think this is too dismissive of some pretty deep ethical and philosophical considerations. Effectively they are giving drugs that alter ones perception of reality and then judging their effectiveness on the patients perspective. But since they alter their perception of reality it's tough to rely on patient reports. Anecdota…

Did any of your anecdotal cases have terminal cancer? And did they take the drugs in a professional therapeutic context? In a medical context, we can evaluate this as objectively as we evaluate painkillers or antidepressants. We can use our normal tests for anxiety and depression, run studies where we watch outcomes, etc. From what I've seen, the effects have been very positive for these patients.

My aunt died of cancer a couple of years ago. She took an unorthodox treatment of extremely high doses of marijuana, which her husband encouraged. It was frustrating for the rest of the family since it was impossible to have a coherent and meaningful conversation with her in her final months. My dad and I had some doubt about it, but the decision was entirely in the hands of her husband because she was too inebriated to think for herself. I’m not saying it was a wrong choice necessarily, but there are downsides.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#126
post #96
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another aspect which is absolutely need to good is the company that you take the drugs in. Once, I took LSD with a couple of "friends" of mine, which turned out to be a sort of devil-worshiping ritual to indoctrinate me into their cult. Apparently all of them had went through this process where they played a niche genre of music called "darkpsy" which is absolutely horrendous to your ears. From my experience of the e…

Totally agree. The time it all went wrong for me, the whole thing was a bad idea from the start. Something terrible had just happened in my friend's family, and we weren't going into it responsibly, and/or to have a fun experience - we just wanted to get fucked up, and took waaaay too much. Right before things went bad, we had an argument, and I ended up alone for a long time. For anyone that's going to use mushrooms…

If someone wants to get fucked up and not remember, alcohol is the way to go.

Mushrooms are the opposite of “fucked up” they’re “tuning in”.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#127
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you thought about trying to find that teacher today and explaining him what actually happened back then with the mushrooms and the essay? Would make for an incredible story

I hadn't thought about that! I can only recall the teacher's nickname (which wasn't exactly complimentary), and I'm not in contact with anyone from those days, so I guess it's a non-starter. Plus, during my school years we were all taught that if you did any drugs at all, you'd end up a disgraced heroin user that would end up on the streets and die, and all the teachers seemed to fully buy-in to this notion.

Maybe they did all buy in. But it’s good to remember that they were only paid to “seem to” buy in.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#128
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are these long term side effects as common with a single dose of psilocybin? Or are they mainly the result of stronger psychedelics given over multiple doses.

My friend developed a chronic mental illness after one bad trip. It is like playing Russian Roulette with your brain chemistry.

Chronic mental illness, for those predisposed, can be brought on by a variety of stressors, of which bad trips can be one. You can look up the stress-diathesis model (1). Of course stone cold sober people can also be at risk of chronic mental illness from stressors; Look at mental health in followers of the LDS church, who abstain from alcohol, tobacco and caffeine. (2)

That means that people who are more predisposed to mental illness or under stress should be cautious around drugs (whether legally available or not), just like people with diabetes should be cautious about their blood sugar. It doesn't mean that drugs can't have beneficial effects and be used safely.

(1) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diathesis%E2%80%93stress_model (2) https://universe.byu.edu/2018/02/05/mental-illness-1/

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#129
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did any of your anecdotal cases have terminal cancer? And did they take the drugs in a professional therapeutic context? In a medical context, we can evaluate this as objectively as we evaluate painkillers or antidepressants. We can use our normal tests for anxiety and depression, run studies where we watch outcomes, etc. From what I've seen, the effects have been very positive for these patients.

My aunt died of cancer a couple of years ago. She took an unorthodox treatment of extremely high doses of marijuana, which her husband encouraged. It was frustrating for the rest of the family since it was impossible to have a coherent and meaningful conversation with her in her final months. My dad and I had some doubt about it, but the decision was entirely in the hands of her husband because she was too inebriated…

This seems like an awfully self-centered way of viewing the situation.

Re: Magic mushrooms are changing the lives of terminal cancer patients

#130
post #129
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My aunt died of cancer a couple of years ago. She took an unorthodox treatment of extremely high doses of marijuana, which her husband encouraged. It was frustrating for the rest of the family since it was impossible to have a coherent and meaningful conversation with her in her final months. My dad and I had some doubt about it, but the decision was entirely in the hands of her husband because she was too inebriated…

This seems like an awfully self-centered way of viewing the situation.

How so? I was respectful of her decision -- although I suspect it was more her husband's decision -- but I wouldn't have made the same myself. It seemed like there was a lot she had to say, but couldn't in that state due to the drug. I suppose she thought she was making sense, but objectively wasn't.
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