Live data from Hacker News

Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

sciencemag.org

121–130 of 315 posts

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#121
post #95

Fuuuuuuuck. I understand the decision to dismantle the failing structure which is currently unsafe and tricky to repair. But might a new one be built in its place? How can we push for that?

Give your own money and/or find someone that will invest in the project.

Anybody got the number to SR Hadden?

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#122

This is horrible. Arecibo is still crucial in radio astronomy experiments ongoing as of 2019. It should be repaired, until a replacement is built.

As the article explains, it has been deemed to be unsafe to repair. What's probably missing in that sentence is "...within an acceptable budget."

The article also says the NSF has been looking to divest since 2006 in favor of other projects and had a signed agreement to transfer operations to UCF. It's not simply a matter of whether or not it's still useful, but whether it's worth the cost relative to other facilities.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#124
post #58

Sad day. I worked in radio astronomy and stayed on site for a week a few years back. Amazing telescope, the scale of it has to be seen to be believed. They have had serious funding issues for some time now, so now that it needs repair, I figured they might retire it. Unfortunate for all the staff that work there, it employed quite a few people. RIP Arecibo.

The Arecibo Observatory is not closing. They're only dismantling that structure. They can continue to conduct science there.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#125
post #34

When I was 5 years old, I saw a pbs documentary about the Arecibo telescope. During a shot of a huge expanse of the telescope's metal, the narrator said something to the effect of "as one gets closer to the equator the sun's rays are stronger and the metal becomes too hot to touch". This, combined with the fact that I had a globe with a raised ridge around the equator, caused me to assume (for many years) that the eq…

That's delightful. The ecology of science education misconceptions is a wild and wonderful thing. My best laugh of yesterday was this page[1] from the Stanford Solar Center, saying "It is a common misconception that the Sun is yellow, or orange or even red."... now look the page header, and at the rest of the site. Gee, I wonder where students, including astronomy graduate students, might come by such misconceptions??? :) Literal lol. And yet, that's still doing better than many a colorful NASA and solar observatory outreach site, that don't even manage that sentence.

I wonder, if a simple CSS radial gradient was available, to easily create a realistic image of the Sun, might people (someone; anyone) use that instead of the usual yellow circles and assorted misleading colorfulness? Something like [2], but for its suboptimal choice of white point (so whiter in the center), and maybe the rim edge isn't quite right. Perhaps homeschoolers might pick it up if it was posted... somewhere?

[1] http://solar-center.stanford.edu/SID/activities/SunDetermine... [2] https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/16622/need-help-si...

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick and probably very inaccurate calculation Arecibo cost $9.3 million in 1963. This is equal to $79,000,000 now ( https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1963?amount=93000... ). An F-35 costs about $100 million. Based on that, I'd be happy to give up a single F-35 to rebuild Arecibo.

And the US is planning to purchase 2500 of those. Because 2400 are clearly not enough.

The scale of how much money the USA spends pointlessly on weapons is almost as mind boggling to comprehend as the size of the galaxy. It's depressing to imagine what we could do otherwise if all this money wasn't wasted, or if it was simply returned to taxpayers.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#127

The thing was iconic... even if not everyone watching/playing Goldeneye knew it was a real radio telescope, it was nevertheless one of those science megaprojects that featured prominently in the popular zeitgeist and got more than one young kid excited about what's out there in the stars. But infrastructure ages, and 60 years isn't a bad run. What comes next? Clearly there's going to be a capabilities gap for a while…

Arecibo has been superseded in terms of raw aperture by FAST, and in terms of angular resolution by the interferometry arrays since 1966 at the latest when the One Mile observatory was doing 23 arcsecond resolution images. I think it's main somewhat unique capability was doing radar measurements of things in our solar system.

My impressions is the neglect comes from having done all the useful things it could do ages ago, and not finding anything new to help with in the areas of science that gets funding.

The state of the art interferometry arrays are ASKAP and MeerKAT currently, in the sense of being the newest and being precusors of the SKA which is the biggest project right now.

In terms of best in class, it varies with the specific frequency and which bit of the sky you want to look at and also with what you consider an observatory: the Event Horizon Telescope that resolved the M87 black hole has the worlds best resolution at their mm wavelengths, but it's really a bunch of existing telescopes collaborating and not a purpose built facility.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#128
post #28

Is this a symbol of the degradation of human intellectual capability in the 21st century?

Tbf China has one that's half a kilometer wide, so there's still hope for progress :) http://www.hexapolis.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Worlds-L...

The China one doesn't have the ability to transmit, only receive.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#129
post #103

That's too bad; glad I got a chance to visit a couple years ago. If anyone is wondering what's next: as others have noted, there's China's FAST antenna. That's a dish format telescope similar (but bigger) to Arecibo. The politics of this inevitably makes some scientists nervous. There is also the Square Kilometre Array (SKA) coming online soon. This is phased array format, similar to VLA, and covers a similar frequen…

I was in Puerto Rico for a wedding several years ago and made it an absolute non-negotiable must-visit during that trip. No way was I going to be that close and not go see it. So glad I did. It felt like mecca for science nerds. I bought all the souvenirs I could. So sad to see it go.

Re: Arecibo telescope, on the brink of collapse, will be dismantled

#130
post #103

That's too bad; glad I got a chance to visit a couple years ago. If anyone is wondering what's next: as others have noted, there's China's FAST antenna. That's a dish format telescope similar (but bigger) to Arecibo. The politics of this inevitably makes some scientists nervous. There is also the Square Kilometre Array (SKA) coming online soon. This is phased array format, similar to VLA, and covers a similar frequen…

> There is also the Square Kilometre Array (SKA) coming online soon. This is phased array format, similar to VLA, and covers a similar frequency band as Arecibo (unlike VLA). I have to wonder if this factored into the calculus to let Arecibo go.

In some sense I'm sure it did, but the USA is not a part of the SKA collaboration, so it's not a direct replacement.

Post reply on HN