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YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

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Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#121

Post by toyg »

gbl08ma wrote: post #101
toyg wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since this affects only tests, they could easily change the relevant scripts to download a list of test videos at runtime. I bet the RIAA github-scrapers would not "see" it. Just serve statically a rot13-encoded list of URLs from pastebin or something, and Bob's your uncle.

Based on what I saw in past discussions, I'm pretty sure that the takedown was not a run-of-the-mill scraper-based takedown (it makes no sense to be taken down just for linking to videos which, at best, is what any scrapers would have seen in the original test code). It was very much an intentional, manual one with actual lawyers behind it.

There are multiple sides to "defending" a project like this. One of them is avoiding to trip the run-of-the-mill scrapers. The takedown was serious but we don't know what triggered the lawyers' attention in the first place. IMHO a simple runtime obfuscation would remove that particular attack vector, once coupled with some plausible deniability (i.e. deleting all downloaded data once tested). At that point, YTDL is still on RIAA's generic shitlist (which will require other mitigations to survive) but at least doesn't get flagged every week by a scraper.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#122

Post by Gaelan »

boomboomsubban wrote: post #82
torstenvl wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, this is what caused me to install it. Have downloaded one video so far - a U.S. government work, so no copyright.

If the RIAA notice is to be believed, you've still admitted to a crime as you've bypassed YouTube's DRM, which is their hosting of the video in other public links.

IIRC, YouTube actually does apply extra DRM to some videos (ones "owned" by the RIAA, maybe others?)

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#123

Post by jedimastert »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #14
boogies wrote: post #8

Great, now they can import the issues to a GitLab/Gitea instance hosted by the same Germans who refused to ever take down youtube-dl.org, and a few other places for redundancy, and not have to go through all this excess stress again.

I have trouble believing gitlab would just ignore a DMCA takedown request? This is what people believe? This is something gitlab has said? Actually, I guess I'm not sure of the consequences to a company of ignoring DMCA takedown requests (whether or not they are US companies; but Gitlab is now btw), but I assume they are not good, or why do companies bother complying? Rather than assume, I should look into it. But ye…

> Actually, I guess I'm not sure of the consequences to a company of ignoring DMCA takedown requests (whether or not they are US companies; but Gitlab is now btw), but I assume they are not good, or why do companies bother complying? Rather than assume, I should look into it.

The request is essentially a precursor to a lawsuit, so the consequences are a potential lawsuit and all of the legal fees that go along with it.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#124

Post by HelloNurse »

kortilla wrote: post #110
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm convinced the companies considered as 'evil' now didn't think they would at first either. Something something unintended consequences. I mean Reddit; bastion of free speech or platform for hate speech? (they cracked down on that over the years) Dropbox; File synchronization and sharing platform or child porn exchange? Airbnb; Great way to find an affordable place to stay and / or rent out unused room, or platform…

But who goes into being an RIAA lawyer position thinking it’s going to be good at first? You have to have believed in the RIAA’s stance from the get-go because it hasn’t really changed.

Or you have to be a morally and professionally substandard lawyer who cannot find a better job.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#126

Post by dastx »

crumbshot wrote: post #15
envy2 wrote: post #3

Excellent. Looks like they've removed the tests for RIAA member videos as the only change, which I assume helped get this restored: https://github.com/ytdl-org/youtube-dl/commit/1fb034d029c8b7...

And not even purged from the repo, it's still in the history if needed. Seems like the copyright holders making a big fuss over nothing really.

My experience has been that Github doesn't ever purge commits from the history. Even when you rewrite the history, all the dangling commits are still there and can be access. I've yet to find a way to force Github to do a gc so such commits are removed. Without Github running a GC on the repo, the commits will not be removed.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#127

Post by clankyclanker »

kortilla wrote: post #110
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm convinced the companies considered as 'evil' now didn't think they would at first either. Something something unintended consequences. I mean Reddit; bastion of free speech or platform for hate speech? (they cracked down on that over the years) Dropbox; File synchronization and sharing platform or child porn exchange? Airbnb; Great way to find an affordable place to stay and / or rent out unused room, or platform…

But who goes into being an RIAA lawyer position thinking it’s going to be good at first? You have to have believed in the RIAA’s stance from the get-go because it hasn’t really changed.

They’re rent-seeking, and probably view themselves as necessary redistributors of wealth, like landlords, but for copyright enforcement and expansion instead of housing.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#128

Post by momothereal »

CivBase wrote: post #37

GitHub is still hosting the full youtube-dl version history, including versions which include those supposedly infringing tests. Does copyright law end with HEAD on master? Those tests are still there. This makes it especially obvious that the RIAA's problem with youtube-dl was never really the tests.

I suppose it depends on how the claim is formulated? Take the CraftBukkit[1] claim for example. In that case, all commits since a specific point, plus all forks, were taken down:

"Pages including infringing content: [...] infringing as of commit [...] and every subsequent commit, including all forks that contain this commit [...] and all forks that share a common first commit [...] and every subsequent commit, including all forks that contain this commit"

This made any effort for restoration futile, since most of the repo was being claimed.

[1] https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2014/2014-09-05-C...

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#129

Post by jaggirs »

contravariant wrote: post #58
jacquesm wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They see themselves as the last bastion of decency in a world full of violation.

This is neither here nor there but Nobel Prize winner Gerard 't Hooft has written an opinion piece on wrong-way drivers in science who seem convinced that everyone else is going the wrong way [1] (it's in Dutch unfortunately, but then the Dutch the word 'spookrider' (lit. 'ghostrider') is a lot cooler than 'wrong-way driver' IMHO). It's a concept that's somehow always stuck with me whenever I hear about people who se…

I think he is right. But I don't like his tone.

The whole writeup is a tantrum on why you should stick to "well known" facts. Which sounds to me too much like asserting the truth of things without questioning them. Yes, there are a lot of fools out there whith a spookrijder complex that are a detriment to science. And I would assume a well-known professor would rightly get tired of their emails.

He only shortly adresses at the end that radical ideas are precisely what is needed for progress in science.

I do not think this dismissive mentality does the situation any good. If someone comes with a radical but stupid idea, you need to first recognize the merit in the idea, and then show why it is wrong. Bashing someone with "you cannot create free energy" will only encourage him to waste his time trying to prove you wrong.

I suspect a lot of these spookrijders are curious and fairly smart people, but who's ideas where offhandedly dismissed by a teacher one too many times.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#130

Post by shawnz »

envy2 wrote: post #3

Excellent. Looks like they've removed the tests for RIAA member videos as the only change, which I assume helped get this restored: https://github.com/ytdl-org/youtube-dl/commit/1fb034d029c8b7...

Shouldn't these tests be considered fair use since they are arguably necessary to validate interoperability?
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