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Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#121

Post by bmitc »

throwawaysea wrote: post #61

It seems unethical to obtain private financial records and leak all this information. I’ve had journalists reach out to colleagues every now and then, looking for private and confidential information and this feels similar, where it isn’t whistleblowing but simply digging up information that no one has any right to. If this is OK, is everything okay? Would any disclosure of private information get a pass? Is doxxing…

Is it more unethical than a president, whose words and actions and directives directly impact the livelihood and wellbeing of hundreds of millions of people, being hundreds of millions of dollars in debt, possibly to foreign entities? Not only has he directly lied about his businesses and foreign business deals, he is in massive debt, with much of it not paid at all. That creates huge conflicts of interest. Is it ethical to have a sitting president wondering how he’ll pay off, potentially foreign lenders, during the middle of his term?

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#122

Post by apta »

jayd16 wrote: post #98
chongli wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No person has an obligation, legal or moral, to pay a cent more in taxes than what they owe under the tax code. If you have a problem with people avoiding taxes, you can endeavour to change the tax code and plug those loopholes. Otherwise, you’re really trying to solve a legal problem by social means. You’re perfectly in your right to do so, but plenty of people will disagree with you.

We're talking about a public servant. It just highlights a cutthroat selfishness in past actions and current politics. >No person has an obligation, legal or moral, to pay a cent more in taxes than what they owe under the tax code. But let me ask you something. Do you believe there is zero moral obligation or simply that the current tax code is at the absolute pinnacle of moral balance?

Does that mean that every government employee should not be allowed to avoid taxes?

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#123

Post by apta »

phobosanomaly wrote: post #96
microcolonel wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don't understand why “tax avoidance” is meant to sound so naughty. Almost everyone avoids taxes, almost every time they might be subject to a tax; some people are just better at it. When you fail to collect taxes from somebody who is following the law, that is a matter for your tax code, not a moral failing of the filer.

As a normal American citizen, I often overpay taxes and then collect the amount I overpaid in my return. I certainty don't cook up elaborate schemes to avoid paying taxes. Does that make me stupid? I consider it a moral responsibility to pay back the community college and state university system, as well as the state and country that gave me access to the infrastructure and opportunity to earn that taxable income.

> I certainty don't cook up elaborate schemes to avoid paying taxes. Does that make me stupid?

Tax avoidance is legal, and if you're overpaying, it means you're giving the government money which you could have used in the meantime. I prefer to keep my money.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#124

Post by softwaredoug »

kache_ wrote: post #17

Reminder; tax avoidance != tax fraud.

I think journalists will hesitate to equate sketchiness to crime as the latter is a legal finding after a formal investigation. They will tend to just point to sketchiness in suggestive language.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#125

Post by softwaredoug »

mellosouls wrote: post #101

OT (apologies): I submitted a link about Trump's nomination for Supreme court; it was immediately killed as political. I checked to see if there was a thread about RBG before submitting. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24602735 Now there is a story about Trump's taxes that is ok to discuss. Genuine question: how is it determined what is ok to discuss on HN and what is political?

Based on people flagging submissions. I flagged this for the reasons you cite. Surprised it’s lasted so long.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#126

Post by digitaltrees »

tertiary wrote: post #102
ENOTTY wrote: post #30

Great thread here that covers his loans https://twitter.com/DanAlexander21/status/131034616181606400... EDIT: I accidentally a 'that'

For those that don't want to click through: He is on the hook personally for hundreds of millions of dollars in debt that will come due next few years during his potential second term with no obvious way of paying it off. There's no way of knowing who has control of it. Edit: and also from the thread, he owes > $1 Billion in total to lenders.

How can anyone seriously support him being in a position of power if this is true. The opportunity to buy that debt and call it as leverage to extract political gain is so easy and obvious. Does any of this debt trade on any market? If so a hedge fund could basically have puppet strings on the federal government.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#127

Post by eli_gottlieb »

microcolonel wrote: post #94
yokaze wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite a different thing though if you are head of government which is supposed to collect taxes from people like you, and you see no need to change that.

> Quite a different thing though if you are head of government which is supposed to collect taxes from people like you, and you see no need to change that. His predecessors/competitors talk a big game, but they were in office for eight years; take a lucky guess whether it got easier or harder, under the Obama-Biden administration, for people in Donald Trump's business to deduct and reclassify almost all of their taxa…

As I recall, the Republican Congress actually cut funding to the IRS for tax enforcement during Obama's second term, so we actually don't know who's committing tax fraud. The audits just aren't being done.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#128

Post by throwawaysea »

bmitc wrote: post #121
throwawaysea wrote: post #61

It seems unethical to obtain private financial records and leak all this information. I’ve had journalists reach out to colleagues every now and then, looking for private and confidential information and this feels similar, where it isn’t whistleblowing but simply digging up information that no one has any right to. If this is OK, is everything okay? Would any disclosure of private information get a pass? Is doxxing…

Is it more unethical than a president, whose words and actions and directives directly impact the livelihood and wellbeing of hundreds of millions of people, being hundreds of millions of dollars in debt, possibly to foreign entities? Not only has he directly lied about his businesses and foreign business deals, he is in massive debt, with much of it not paid at all. That creates huge conflicts of interest. Is it eth…

Yes it is totally ethical. What makes it unethical? America draws its leaders from the citizenry. Those citizens are allowed to borrow money, be in debt, and retain privacy of their confidential information. Entering politics doesn’t deprive them of their identity as a citizen.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#129

Post by andrei_says_ »

digitaltrees wrote: post #126
tertiary wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those that don't want to click through: He is on the hook personally for hundreds of millions of dollars in debt that will come due next few years during his potential second term with no obvious way of paying it off. There's no way of knowing who has control of it. Edit: and also from the thread, he owes > $1 Billion in total to lenders.

How can anyone seriously support him being in a position of power if this is true. The opportunity to buy that debt and call it as leverage to extract political gain is so easy and obvious. Does any of this debt trade on any market? If so a hedge fund could basically have puppet strings on the federal government.

Simple: it is not “true” to those who support him. They are told a completely different story - one of a successful businessman with unbending will, unfairly persecuted by the media, here to manifest God’s plan.

Yes, including that last one. Talk to any fundamental Christian on why.

Re: Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance

#130

Post by refurb »

tertiary wrote: post #102
ENOTTY wrote: post #30

Great thread here that covers his loans https://twitter.com/DanAlexander21/status/131034616181606400... EDIT: I accidentally a 'that'

For those that don't want to click through: He is on the hook personally for hundreds of millions of dollars in debt that will come due next few years during his potential second term with no obvious way of paying it off. There's no way of knowing who has control of it. Edit: and also from the thread, he owes > $1 Billion in total to lenders.

What is his net worth? I didn't see it in the article.

Whether or not his debts are an issue really depends on how much wealth he has to back it up.

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