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Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

uk.reuters.com

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Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#121

Post by 127 »

lovich wrote: post #42
controversy wrote: post #35

The United States is not much better in terms of this. We have a free press in name only. If you are saying something that certain people don’t like, you are canceled. Your tweets will be taken down since you violated weakly worded community standards. You will be flagged on HN. Etc. Ultimately we have a dictatorship of ideas. The best answer so far is to go make a freedom platform with blackjack and hookers. Essenti…

>Ultimately we have a dictatorship of ideas What an amazing way to phrase "others don't like what I am saying and don't want to associate with me". The government controlling social media platforms is vastly different from a collection of companies controlling social media platforms that they built. There's an argument that can be made about companies needing to treat their platforms as public squares depending on if…

Madness of the crowds. It's also interesting that this phrase brings only search results from Douglas Murray, who has been widely attacked as far right (and thus untouchable). The social and psychological effect is much more meaningful and important.

https://ncase.me/crowds/

To be clear I don't oppose to what is being said. I'm opposed to how it's being said. If there's only one allowed dogma, there's no chance of correcting the course and logically it will always end in a disaster.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#122

Post by stronglikedan »

pjc50 wrote: post #90
umvi wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is why we can have an election outcome that no one in the media predicted. I'm surprised you chose this as the prime example. I think things surrounding George Floyd protests are more apt examples (tearing down arbitrary statues, cancel culture, CHOP/CHAZ, social media mobs, etc).

The statues are not arbitrary and many of them have been objected to for years. Similarly, US police have been routinely murdering people for years. What social media has done is allow the creation of a "headless" protest movement that can outrun attempts to take it down. In both cases, some people have leapt in and gone too far because they enjoy the chaos, but don't let that obscure the real issues. No, the problem…

Grant is most certainly arbitrary.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#123

Post by ferzul »

salmonfamine wrote: post #100
briefcomment wrote: post #24

In a dictatorship, cracking down on social media is a no brainer. But I think social media undermines democracies as well. Social media vastly amplifies loud minorities. Democracy assumes that the majority of people are reasonable, so majority rule will also be reasonable. Loud minorities undermine majority rule. Loud minorities have always existed, but social media is now amplifying them to the point of obscuring wh…

I think we're encountering a fundamental conflict between an unregulated free market and a digital economy that doesn't have any notion of scarcity or cost. The old paradigm just doesn't fit. And the result is that a handful of tech employees and billionaires can wield outsized influence over the dominant media channels and public forums of the entire world without any democratic input or regulatory oversight. The fa…

so how does that work? i cannot think of a workable solution short of an end to the world wide web, and the beginning of a system of national internets and data ports (as in, places you send your data to to export them from one country and import them to another).

otherwise, the democratic oversight will just be whatever the u.s can manage.

the internet is already falling apart; i notice many u.s media sites are inaccessible from europe. i guess national internets are less painful in europe, where almost every country has its own language, than in the anglosphere, where there are many smaller countries that use english.

it solves many problems - it puts an end to cyberattacks, for instance. but is it right? i doubt it.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#124

Post by zentiggr »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #66
SecurityMinded wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the paper, Turkiye is a democracy. In reality, since 1950's it was not. It is a dictatorship or oligarchy at best, funded by the big money of the world, mostly from the US. Rigged elections, placing puppet governments (like Tayyip) is an ongoing theme. At the time of election, people are given the impression of who they are electing as it is in a democracy, while the result is already known by the powers that be.…

If Turkey is a puppet, who's holding the strings?

What does their export market and foreign currency reserves tell you? (I don't know myself, just suggesting the points of leverage.)

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#125

Post by stronglikedan »

syshum wrote: post #120
augustt wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Columbus has been a point of contention for a while now. Regardless, corporations are not saying BLM because some tiny segment of the country thinks that. A majority of America supports the movement, and that's being reflected by PR now. The last line of defense for conservatives is "well actually there's a silent majority that thinks otherwise" and "actually most people don't care, they're just virtue signaling". An…

>>BLM because some tiny segment of the country thinks that. A majority of America supports the movement, and that's being reflected by PR now. A majority of the nation supports the Statement "Black Lives matter" a Majority of the nation supports reforming the police and holding them accountable. And a majority of the nation supports ending systemic racism in our laws and institutions BLM as movement / organization ho…

> And a majority of the nation supports ending systemic racism in our laws and institutions

I'd wager that a majority of the nation knows there's no "systemic" racism in our laws and institutions, but does support ending the institutional problems that affect everyone who enters the justice system.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#126

Post by controversy »

throwaway29102 wrote: post #56
controversy wrote: post #35

The United States is not much better in terms of this. We have a free press in name only. If you are saying something that certain people don’t like, you are canceled. Your tweets will be taken down since you violated weakly worded community standards. You will be flagged on HN. Etc. Ultimately we have a dictatorship of ideas. The best answer so far is to go make a freedom platform with blackjack and hookers. Essenti…

You have every right to stand on a street corner and preach whatever manner of nonsense you want. There are two people doing that on the street below me right now (one is a charlatan peddling superstition, the other is a conspiracy theorist warning of the dangers of 5G). Your complaint in this context would be that my landlord isn’t giving you a stage and a megaphone?

My complaint is that these corporations get wide legal protections because they claim to be an open platform. In reality there are ideologs within them that exert editorial control by exalting (by promoted content channels) or deriding by means of either outright banning or vote manipulation of speech. If they were publishers, I am fine with such behavior. Since they derive monetary benefit from the wide legal birth, I decry them openly as tinpot dictators.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#128

Post by analyte123 »

briefcomment wrote: post #24

In a dictatorship, cracking down on social media is a no brainer. But I think social media undermines democracies as well. Social media vastly amplifies loud minorities. Democracy assumes that the majority of people are reasonable, so majority rule will also be reasonable. Loud minorities undermine majority rule. Loud minorities have always existed, but social media is now amplifying them to the point of obscuring wh…

Legacy media amplifies a loud minority too: owners, managers, and employees of media corporations. Most of the "controversy" around social media, stoked by legacy media, comes down to the old loud minority not liking that a different loud minority might get a say.

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#129

Post by syshum »

stronglikedan wrote: post #125
syshum wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>BLM because some tiny segment of the country thinks that. A majority of America supports the movement, and that's being reflected by PR now. A majority of the nation supports the Statement "Black Lives matter" a Majority of the nation supports reforming the police and holding them accountable. And a majority of the nation supports ending systemic racism in our laws and institutions BLM as movement / organization ho…

> And a majority of the nation supports ending systemic racism in our laws and institutions I'd wager that a majority of the nation knows there's no "systemic" racism in our laws and institutions, but does support ending the institutional problems that affect everyone who enters the justice system.

I dont know that I agree there is no racism in the laws. The War on Drugs is littered with laws that seem to have no other explanation that targeted racism. The most well known example is the Sentencing disparity between Crack and Cocaine.

I would agree that not everything that is claimed to be racism based is in fact racism based, alot of it is Class based as well. But to say there is NO racism in the law is also an position that is not supported by the historical record

Re: Turkey determined to control social media platforms, Erdogan says

#130

Post by latraveler »

lovich wrote: post #42
controversy wrote: post #35

The United States is not much better in terms of this. We have a free press in name only. If you are saying something that certain people don’t like, you are canceled. Your tweets will be taken down since you violated weakly worded community standards. You will be flagged on HN. Etc. Ultimately we have a dictatorship of ideas. The best answer so far is to go make a freedom platform with blackjack and hookers. Essenti…

>Ultimately we have a dictatorship of ideas What an amazing way to phrase "others don't like what I am saying and don't want to associate with me". The government controlling social media platforms is vastly different from a collection of companies controlling social media platforms that they built. There's an argument that can be made about companies needing to treat their platforms as public squares depending on if…

HN/Reddit ...

Good = Social media companies selectively controlling the platform they built

Bad = Telecom companies selectively controlling the platform they built

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