Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge • Hacker News Board

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#121

Post by laegooose » Mon, May 11, 2020, 11:37 AM UTC

rmrfstar wrote: post #56

pravda wrote: post #19

A question for the Android experts: is it possible to block or spoof location data, through a custom build? Could I have an Android phone running a program that spoofs a long steady drive from Tampa to Butte?

Yes, but that does not stop the cell providers from selling your location [1]. You could also run an Android VM in the cloud and RDP to it when you want to use sketchy (edit: free) apps. This approach could have saved Bezos some trouble [2]. [1] https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/nepxbz/i-gave-a-bounty-hu... [2] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/22/technology/jeff-bezos-hac...

[2] says Bezos' iPhone was hacked via WhatsApp with the NSO Group-developed exploit. It is not possible to run iOS VM in the cloud, and even for Android it does not sound practical at all.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#122

Post by eitland » Mon, May 11, 2020, 11:42 AM UTC

amelius wrote: post #108

eitland wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember that many people ‘have nothing to hide’ so they turn on services like Google Latitude. Then later they’re al surprised when their data is sold to the highest bidder. Do you have any proof that Google does exactly this? I don't like Google at all (anymore) but I thought Google was somewhat ok in that they never sold my raw data points even if they would sell accesss to place an ad to "visitors who have been…

> even if they would sell accesss to place an ad to "visitors who have been at this geographic location recently So if I click on the ad, the company behind it knows I was on that geographic location recently. This is how Google leaks data.

Yep, but that is still on a vastly different scale than what this article is talking about where raw data points are dumped.

I'm not saying that the case you mention isn't problematic but there's still a not the same as being able to follow you around the city.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#123

Post by meritt » Mon, May 11, 2020, 11:43 AM UTC

inapis wrote: post #120

martimarkov wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait... WHAT?!?! I mean if I think about it, yeah that makes sense to have been built but WTF?!? Care to share which email client it is? It should be killed with fire!!!

I believe that GP is talking about the unroll.me service which was caught selling purchase receipts to companies like Uber a few months ago.

I was referring to https://mail.edison.tech/, but they compete with unroll.me (rakuten intelligence) in selling people's emails.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#124

Post by thdrdt » Mon, May 11, 2020, 11:55 AM UTC

surround wrote: post #76

The article assumes that the location data must have been collected because he gave an app permission to access his location. I bet they couldn’t figure out which app it was because it wasn’t an app. Cell service providers can and do track your cellphone location. All they have to do is measure the signal strength of your cellphone at different towers, and they can triangulate its position. https://www.vice.com/en_us…

This is what always bothers me in movies. There is a secret meeting. Everybody pulls out their sim because they don't want their location to be known.

Well.. no, you already revealed where you were going.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#125

Post by thdrdt » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:06 PM UTC

tinus_hn wrote: post #93

surround wrote: post #76

The article assumes that the location data must have been collected because he gave an app permission to access his location. I bet they couldn’t figure out which app it was because it wasn’t an app. Cell service providers can and do track your cellphone location. All they have to do is measure the signal strength of your cellphone at different towers, and they can triangulate its position. https://www.vice.com/en_us…

That kind of triangulation is nowhere near precise enough to reveal the data shown in the article. This is GPS data which the provider does not get. Remember that many people ‘have nothing to hide’ so they turn on services like Google Latitude. Then later they’re al surprised when their data is sold to the highest bidder.

Not exactly. In cities more towers are placed together to give better coverage (for 5G this is a must). Triangulation can then be as accurate as 30 meters.

If you then have a dataset of lets say 100 points around a location you can estimate the exact location even better.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#126

Post by zeepzeep » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:09 PM UTC

surround wrote: post #74

cocoa19 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Ultimately, free is the culprit. " False... Plenty of companies take your money and still sell your data.

...such as cell service providers. All of them (in the US, at least) sell your location and browsing data to advertisers. I would happily pay for a provider that doesn’t triangulate my location 24/7, but none exist.

Right? Seems like enough people are willing to pay for their privacy, the demand is there.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#127

Post by wizzwizz4 » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:10 PM UTC

etrabroline wrote: post #81

martimarkov wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait... WHAT?!?! I mean if I think about it, yeah that makes sense to have been built but WTF?!? Care to share which email client it is? It should be killed with fire!!!

Assuming you're asking a genuine question, it's Gmail. https://mail.google.com/

No, no, Google doesn't read your emails (any more); they just give access to them to certain "developers" (read: arbitrary paying third-parties).

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#128

Post by user5994461 » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:15 PM UTC

tinus_hn wrote: post #93

surround wrote: post #76

The article assumes that the location data must have been collected because he gave an app permission to access his location. I bet they couldn’t figure out which app it was because it wasn’t an app. Cell service providers can and do track your cellphone location. All they have to do is measure the signal strength of your cellphone at different towers, and they can triangulate its position. https://www.vice.com/en_us…

That kind of triangulation is nowhere near precise enough to reveal the data shown in the article. This is GPS data which the provider does not get. Remember that many people ‘have nothing to hide’ so they turn on services like Google Latitude. Then later they’re al surprised when their data is sold to the highest bidder.

>>> That kind of triangulation is nowhere near precise enough to reveal the data shown in the article.

Here, have a read at this article on how cell phone operate and how to track them. Wrote that a few years ago.

https://thehftguy.com/2017/07/19/what-does-it-really-take-to...

And the HN discussion, where developers admit they've been developing that for real for years: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14803443

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#129

Post by gvb » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:20 PM UTC

eitland wrote: post #107

tinus_hn wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That kind of triangulation is nowhere near precise enough to reveal the data shown in the article. This is GPS data which the provider does not get. Remember that many people ‘have nothing to hide’ so they turn on services like Google Latitude. Then later they’re al surprised when their data is sold to the highest bidder.

> Remember that many people ‘have nothing to hide’ so they turn on services like Google Latitude. Then later they’re al surprised when their data is sold to the highest bidder. Do you have any proof that Google does exactly this? I don't like Google at all (anymore) but I thought Google was somewhat ok in that they never sold my raw data points even if they would sell accesss to place an ad to "visitors who have been…

Yes. I had it more than once where I purchased an item from a store and, about 10 minutes later, I received a coupon for a discount at the very store I just made the purchase. It happened to my wife as well.

After the second time that happened, I disabled location in my phone settings and only enable it if I have a specific need for it. I have not received any "spontaneous" coupons since disabling locations.

Re: Your mobile data sold, without your knowledge

#130

Post by erikbye » Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:23 PM UTC

You have to be a special case of naive for the collection and sale of data to be a surprise. Talk about living under a rock. As for mobile apps, specifically, you think these shitty apps make money off ads? No, the business model is data. GPS data alone is a multi-billion dollar industry that is growing very fast.