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Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

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Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#121
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about considering the facts of the situation and not generalizing and applying a pre-conceived narrative?

I don't really know how to address the kind of confusion that mistakes a statement of principle for an imposition of narrative.

There's no way to respond seriously to someone who is suggesting we ought not learn from history.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#123
post #25

Why does big always become evil?

> Why does big always become evil? Diffusion of responsibility [1]. I hypothesise the frequency of deliberate evil is similar among companies big and small. What's more frequent with large companies is unchecked sporadic harm. Over time, that accumulates into uncoördinated patterns of behavior. These patterns would get called out in a smaller company. Social mores almost force us to. But those mores get washed out in…

Ding ding ding.

Read a great article once about how trading stocks will turn pretty much anyones actions sociopathic. The gist is that nobody really has to take responsibility, so most just follow the money. Unfortunately, the closer to slavery the better the profit margin.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#124
post #25

Why does big always become evil?

IMO, private companies do not necessarily become evil when they get big, but public companies cannot help but become evil, even when not all that big. (My impression is that public companies are essentially required to maximize profit and shareholder value at any cost... at least at any cost that's technically legal and which wouldn't create significant blowback from society--blowback which would cut into those profi…

On what grounds do you say that public companies have to be unethical within legal limits? If there is any law which states that publicly owned companies have to maximise profit at any cost, then I am not aware of it.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"When you get these jobs that you have been so brilliantly trained for, just remember that your real job is that if you are free, you need to free somebody else. If you have some power, then your job is to empower somebody else. This is not just a grab-bag candy game.” -- Nobel Prize-winning author Toni Morrison

Most people are busy trying to free their children, spouse, and immediate family, even if it means sacrificing others’ freedom to do it.

>Most people are busy trying to free their children, spouse, and immediate family

what you're basically saying is that most people are primarily concerned with their communities. that's true and it's not even unreasonable but what's also true is that the communities of most people in positions of power are not marginalized/precarious.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just how capitalism works. It's about allocating capital in the most efficient way, and as far as Amazon is concerned workers are a dime a dozen. If workers complain, you can just fire them and hire someone else to do the job. This is especially true right now with the high unemployment rate. If workers really want to improve their situation they would all need to unionize. It would require a significant port…

It's not just propaganda. Many of us come from union backgrounds--either our parents, siblings, etc were blue collar workers or teachers or police. We've heard lots of stories of unions creating all kinds of nonsense inefficiencies and then when someone is being targeted by management, the union does little or nothing to protect them. My best friend taught in a low income school district, he was forced out because he…

Yeah, the propaganda has been super effective.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#127
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does everyone assume the actions of the little guy are always morally superior than the actions of the big corporation? I haven't delved into the details of this specific case but this reaction is typical regardless of the facts it seems. The big company is always the evil one and the employees are always little enslaved saints. Edit: Whoops this comment could have been made less controversially - I wish everyone…

When one side has all the power and the other side has none, to pretend that the benefit of the doubt accrues equally to both is an act of moral cowardice.

That's not an argument, just an assertion. All you've done is restate the position the GP was questioning the reasoning behind:

> Q: Why does it seem like big corps never get the benefit of the doubt?

> A: Big corps don't get the benefit of the doubt because they are big. Anyone who disagrees is a moral coward.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#129
post #25

Why does big always become evil?

> Why does big always become evil? Diffusion of responsibility [1]. I hypothesise the frequency of deliberate evil is similar among companies big and small. What's more frequent with large companies is unchecked sporadic harm. Over time, that accumulates into uncoördinated patterns of behavior. These patterns would get called out in a smaller company. Social mores almost force us to. But those mores get washed out in…

I agree with you and would add loss of high level mission. When it becomes unclear to people what the broader goal of the company is and how they fit into it, or if they are only rewarded for achieving a local goal (eg hitting some artificial metric) even if their actions impede the broader goal, then you will only get optimization towards the local goals regardless of overall outcomes.

Re: Amazon VP Resigns, Calls Company ‘Chickenshit’ for Firing Protesting Workers

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When one side has all the power and the other side has none, to pretend that the benefit of the doubt accrues equally to both is an act of moral cowardice.

That's not an argument, just an assertion. All you've done is restate the position the GP was questioning the reasoning behind: > Q: Why does it seem like big corps never get the benefit of the doubt? > A: Big corps don't get the benefit of the doubt because they are big. Anyone who disagrees is a moral coward.

Perhaps you have overlooked that the distinction I drew was one not of size, but of power.
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