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A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

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Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1984 has newspeak, doublethink and a protagonist who's job is falsifying the newspaper archive. But everything is state owned, so it's "us vs the system" not the cyberpunk "Walmart vs Amazon" happening here.

Makes sense, competing vs. centralized fascisms.

[flagged]

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Instead, we just go along with this fake-grassroots idea of "oh yeah Amazon is an evil empire"? Perhaps people really feel that Amazon is an evil empire regardless of this competitor's actions.

I think the point is that the danger may be more with the competitor than with Amazon. Or even worse, they're all equally terrible. Which would mean that no matter what we do, we lose privacy and freedoms. The public is being manipulated into taking actions directly contradictory to its own good either way. One road to death and despair, the other to disease and destruction. You could say, "choose wisely", but it doe…

I think we're still better off if we have multiple equally terrible competitors keeping each other in check than one dominant company unrestrained.

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#123
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Check out the ingredients on your favorite soft drink. There's probably all sorts of stuff listed that has been shown to cause cancer in rats.

It’s odd how that goes. We are never going to subject as many monkeys to coke as people drinking the stuff. So we need to compromise, but rats are not a great model resulting in some false positives. However, presumably some false negatives exist that are silently killing hundreds of thousands of people.

I would like to think that any scientist who dared propose giving to monkeys the equivalent by body mass of the amount of Coca-Cola many humans consume per day would get publicly crucified by an ethics board.

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#124

Okay so wait, we have corporations trying to turn the public against a competitor for being "too successful," in the hopes that it will let them use the apparatus of government to hobble said competitor in any way without repercussions, and no one is upset about this? Instead, we just go along with this fake-grassroots idea of "oh yeah Amazon is an evil empire"? This doesn't process for me. I mean seriously, Amazon i…

Personally that's why I tend to like the American anti-trust standard of consumer welfare, and it bothers me that politicians are trying to dislodge it. It really does bother me when the facets of the complaints against the giants boil down to basically, they're too good at that, or they can do things that others can't. At a blunt level, isn't that the point? Isn't it what we want? When we talk about services, not pe…

Well said. Exactly!

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#125

Okay so wait, we have corporations trying to turn the public against a competitor for being "too successful," in the hopes that it will let them use the apparatus of government to hobble said competitor in any way without repercussions, and no one is upset about this? Instead, we just go along with this fake-grassroots idea of "oh yeah Amazon is an evil empire"? This doesn't process for me. I mean seriously, Amazon i…

>Amazon is so superior to the competition

I think too much efficiency in retail allows people to over-consume, and is a net negative for the environment and mental health... so i would support initiatives like this from a purely philosophical worldview.

progress isn't always progress.

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point is that the danger may be more with the competitor than with Amazon. Or even worse, they're all equally terrible. Which would mean that no matter what we do, we lose privacy and freedoms. The public is being manipulated into taking actions directly contradictory to its own good either way. One road to death and despair, the other to disease and destruction. You could say, "choose wisely", but it doe…

I think we're still better off if we have multiple equally terrible competitors keeping each other in check than one dominant company unrestrained.

Sure, but using the government to enforce the destruction of competitors and new entrants is the shortest way to that outcome. If Walmart wants to compete, that's great. If they want to destroy their competitors, that's... Less so.

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oranges, Mangos, Black Pepper, and lots of other natural things cause cancer in rats

I don't know about you, but I find it easier to consume massive quantities of Coca-Cola than I do black pepper.

Oranges and mangoes, on the other hand...

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point is that the danger may be more with the competitor than with Amazon. Or even worse, they're all equally terrible. Which would mean that no matter what we do, we lose privacy and freedoms. The public is being manipulated into taking actions directly contradictory to its own good either way. One road to death and despair, the other to disease and destruction. You could say, "choose wisely", but it doe…

I think we're still better off if we have multiple equally terrible competitors keeping each other in check than one dominant company unrestrained.

And at the same time, when you do that, you turn a 9mm round that's flying at you, into a shotgun blast.

This whole thing requires more thoughtful consideration. You're talking about "better" off, but we are "best" off without any of the terrible competitors even having the ability to play the game.

Instead of going the anti-trust route for instance, we may just want to make the entire practice of using private data for any commercial reason at all, expressly illegal. Collecting private data at all, should be expressly illegal without the consent of the individual in question. Like a HIPAA-GDPR combo move, except with prison time.

Basically pursuing solutions like that, we should get serious with all these guys.

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#129
post #101

I'm surprised more cyberpunk authors didn't anticipate that wars between corporations wouldn't be fought using hackers or "street samurai", but with teams of propagandists competing to do a better job of bullshitting the general public. Yes, I'm calling marketers and advertisers propagandists. As far as I'm concerned, marketing and advertising are nothing but private-sector psyops.

By that logic, my Tinder profile is nothing but self-sanctioned psyops manipulating people into liking me. I can use scary words to describe mundane things too.

You're like the Devil on the cover of Iron Maiden's The Number of the Beast album[1]. You think you've got Eddie dancing to your tune, but you don't see the strings Eddie is using to make you dance to his tune.

1: https://imgur.com/a/XOzzWnZ

Re: A ‘Grass-Roots’ Campaign to Take Down Amazon Is Funded By Its Biggest Rivals

#130

Okay so wait, we have corporations trying to turn the public against a competitor for being "too successful," in the hopes that it will let them use the apparatus of government to hobble said competitor in any way without repercussions, and no one is upset about this? Instead, we just go along with this fake-grassroots idea of "oh yeah Amazon is an evil empire"? This doesn't process for me. I mean seriously, Amazon i…

Large companies always use the government - when they can - to kneecap their competition. It's the very rare exception of a corporation that won't stoop to that level of behavior. There's practically an unlimited number of excuses a company can come up with to rationalize proceeding (with using the government as a leveling club). It's exactly what many of Microsoft's peers did in the 1990s. They waged a large, persis…

Exactly. I've always had an issue with the whole incident where everyone went after Microsoft.
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