What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth? • Hacker News Board

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#121

Post by thaumasiotes » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 12:59 AM UTC

munk-a wrote: post #87

aashishkoirala wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think MM is 2000 in Roman numerals, no?

You are technically correct, financial dudes like roman numerals but somewhere in history someone (probably someone reeeeeally powerful) started using MM for million and thus started the trend. Aside, swiss watches tend to have a watch maker's four on them instead of the more correct IV... and apparently there are a bunch of other variations out there[1]. Though MM is still quite stupid. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/w…

I believe the thought behind MM is "a thousand thousand", using the roman numeral as if it were a positional digit.

Not sure how someone got the idea to do that...

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#122

Post by ta5436546n4 » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 2:21 AM UTC

thaumasiotes wrote: post #121

munk-a wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are technically correct, financial dudes like roman numerals but somewhere in history someone (probably someone reeeeeally powerful) started using MM for million and thus started the trend. Aside, swiss watches tend to have a watch maker's four on them instead of the more correct IV... and apparently there are a bunch of other variations out there[1]. Though MM is still quite stupid. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/w…

I believe the thought behind MM is "a thousand thousand", using the roman numeral as if it were a positional digit. Not sure how someone got the idea to do that...

Algebraically it makes sense I guess (M.M)

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#123

Post by dr_dshiv » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 5:45 AM UTC

tasty_freeze wrote: post #115

dr_dshiv wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The alternative is rule by non-elites. America has been an aristocratic democracy; when that aristocratic ruling culture is replaced by an anti-elitist culture, it might look worse than you think. I'd argue that the "elite" culture is less self-serving and more noble than the alternative.

You are setting up a false dichotomy: you claim the only two choices are rule by elites vs rule by non-elites. What I spelled out was a half way position -- bolstering the strength of the non-elites and weakening the grip elites have on power. Of course it is difficult to manage precisely because most people with $1B will kick and scream if their wealth is reduced to $900M. But in theory that is what voting can help…

I agree it isn't a dichotomy. I just don't understand anti-elitism. Note the difference between the elite and rich. Trump is the latter and won due to anti-elitism.

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#124

Post by NotSammyHagar » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 8:05 AM UTC

thorwasdfasdf wrote: post #98

rossdavidh wrote: post #23

Comes close to an important point, and then misses it completely. The problem is not that Saudi money would get them influence at new U.S. tech companies. The problem is that Saudi money is getting pushed into "tech" companies that have unsustainable business models, and this is sucking all the oxygen (e.g. available developers) from other projects that could accomplish more. Imagine two startup ideas. One, could be…

Well, there's a vast oversupply of talent out there, so I don't think that investment in unsustainable business models will prevent investment in better areas. VCs will pick the business models that are most likely to succeed. If the most likely ones to succeed aren't doing well, it's because there aren't any better ones (or at least none that have been discovered or made legal thus far).

is that meant to be a sarcastic comment? there's a vast undersupply of programming talent, that's why salaries go up. people are attracted for the super expensive cities like seattle and sf because there's companies importing them.

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#125

Post by euroPoor » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 10:47 AM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #101

euroPoor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it’s difficult, but we all have the means to build social movements, companies or sue if we feel that there’s something terrible going on. But we all like our flights, our cars, our cheaper and cheaper phones, stable policy in the West and perceived security. It’s hard but you can go against it. Just always saying ‘it’s the elite’ and then sitting it out seems really easy to me. Everyone has a conception of…

we all have the means to build social movements, companies or sue if we feel that there’s something terrible going on That's nonsensical. We all have the potential to do such things at some point in our lives, but that is not at all the same as having the means. Just always saying ‘it’s the elite’ and then sitting it out seems really easy to me. So there are some people trying to build an anti-elite social movement o…

Look I’m trying to build alternatives and help struggling social movements. I just don’t agree that the analysis of “it’s the elite, dumbass” is sufficiently clear eyed.

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#126

Post by ianthiel » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 2:51 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #100

asdfman123 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem here isn't oil but simply the power of the global elite. I went into this article thinking "So what? The world runs on oil, and oil has a lot of money. Welcome to learning about the economy." But yeah, it is concerning that private interests that don't share our same niceties about democracy and human rights have power over us.

ExxonMobil has a lot of revenue, but mainly because it has a huge number of people producing a huge amount of product for a huge number of people. Despite nearly 300 billion in revenue, ExxonMobil's profits aren't as big as Google's or Microsoft's or even Facebook's. (At under 7%, Exxon's profit margin is half of Starbucks, and one-sixth that of Facebook.) In many respects, the American oil industry is the antithesis…

I hadn't considered this perspective before, thank you.

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#127

Post by euroPoor » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 6:17 PM UTC

blunte wrote: post #88

euroPoor wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, that’s the whole point. But you can build inertia. Take a look at Europe where there’s tremendous protesting going on regarding Climate Change, and we slowly see some change in for one, public opinion and two in policy making. It’s slow and painful and frustrating but you gotta work and not always blame the ‘global elite’. I know it’s hard to build inertia, I failed in court, I failed at building companies…

Unfortunately, Europe is moving quite westward in terms of politics and ignorance. (I'll just be direct and use the word, karma be damned). So what has happened in the US is happening elsewhere, on a delay. Fortunately, what is not on a delay is the age of the people doing the self-serving, future-burning deeds. Those people will all die within 15 years of each other. Hopefully those who are left will have a bit more…

How much more apocalyptic can you get? Do you think painting an apocalyptic picture and then blaming some parts of the population on the bad parts of your picture will do anything good?

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#128

Post by euroPoor » Tue, Sep 17, 2019, 6:21 PM UTC

blunte wrote: post #82

euroPoor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it’s difficult, but we all have the means to build social movements, companies or sue if we feel that there’s something terrible going on. But we all like our flights, our cars, our cheaper and cheaper phones, stable policy in the West and perceived security. It’s hard but you can go against it. Just always saying ‘it’s the elite’ and then sitting it out seems really easy to me. Everyone has a conception of…

Indeed. This expanded version of your previous comment is accurate. As long as people are still comfortable enough, there will be no change. Unfortunately, it takes great discomfort to motivate people to actually fight for change. (I'm like everyone, so I'm not fighting... yet?) I do believe the internet and global communication does speed up the process, at least when people get near the tipping point. Knowing that…

Thank you. Apparently everyone on HN loves a contrarian until they see one in the wild.

You should get to work, there’s a lot of stuff to do. Of course we need to protect our precious peace and prosperity, but we also need public opinion to reflect on certain issues. And we need policy makers to implement solutions on said certain issues. We’ll get there but it’ll be really damn tiring and exhausting.

Re: What does it mean for American innovation to be backed by oil wealth?

#129

Post by wffurr » Sat, Sep 21, 2019, 2:55 PM UTC

prewett wrote: post #108

wffurr wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, paying taxes that fund drone strikes on civilians means you have blood on your hands. I wish more people realized that...

That's a pretty unhelpfully polarizing statement for something that is a matter of opinion, or at least situational. Suppose you are a citizen of a country (through no choice of your own) that uses public taxes to . Further suppose that you have no ability to influence how your taxes are spent. You have to pay taxes, but it's not at all clear that you are morally complicit for the immoral actions taken with them. You…

I am voting against politicians who are pro-war, which is sadly almost all of them.