Explaining Sex Rate Changes • Hacker News Board

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#121

Post by siwatanejo » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:21 AM UTC

manfredo wrote: post #28

siwatanejo wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Economy getting better" arguments fall into the trap of the law of averages.

Since 2010 GDP is growing, unemployment is going down, and real wages have at least remained steady and many analysts claim it has risen. If the economy really was tied to lack of sex we should be seeing a large spike around 2008/2009 and continuing until 2010 or 2011 and then returning to normal rates by 2018. Granted, there may be some sort of lag between economic changes and the effect on sex lives. E.g. a boyfrie…

> Also I think you're referring to the trap of the law of averages incorrectly.

True, sorry, I was referring to the typical "3 chickens were eaten by 3 people, 1 chicken per person on average; in reality one man ate 3 chickens and the other zero"

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#122

Post by jamescostian » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:21 AM UTC

mantas wrote: post #118

jamescostian wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this is true for divorce situations (probably because of the fighting), but I didn't know that polyamorous parents could mess up a child's psychological development. Any sources for this?

Not the OP, but one important bit for the kid is to have stable set of rules. If there're multiple individuals with different parenting styles, kid gets confused and don't know who to look up to and what rules to follow. That needs good coordination even in mom-dad situation. And gets more and more complicated if more people are involved. More specifically for polyamorous, it seems to keep much harder a stable, jealo…

Those are very good points, thank you. I agree that having more people increases the chances that there will be more different parenting styles. And when the child picks a favorite, there will be more people whose feelings get hurt. And I can totally see how both of those things would negatively impact the parents and child.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#123

Post by flukus » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:23 AM UTC

barry-cotter wrote: post #60

saagarjha wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a difference between unmarried and celibate.

Not before widespread birth control there isn’t. We can see quite clearly the first hints of the demographic transition in France. It starts off with delaying marriage but fertility within marriage basically being an increasing function of time. People had sex and this made babies. But then people stop having so many children. The pull out method was invented or spread society wide for the first time. Our knowledge o…

Even in the relatively abundant west world today 70% of infertility may be caused by diet (https://www.healthstatus.com/health_blog/ovulation-2/diet-an...). In the past poor people had even worse diets, it was probably even worse for the post famine Irish you used as an example.

> Our knowledge of biology is not innate

It's not,but we've known what the result of "seeding a woman" has been for several thousand years so I have a hard time believing it took that long to come up with the pull out method. For the poor bedrooms are also a recent invention, they probably got a lot more sex-ed passed down directly.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#124

Post by anonytrary » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:23 AM UTC

abledon wrote: post #117

thatoneuser wrote: post #109

It's genuinely depressing to think that a large number of guys now has no access to explore intimacy and partnership (or very little). No one's owed sex of course but it's like we're breaking aspects of society. And I think you'd naturally find women are less able to find meaning themselves here so it's not just a men's pity party. I wonder, if this is a dating app phenomenon, if there's anything that can be done tha…

Enforced communal participation in events — similar to having to file your taxes , you just participate in X number of community events in a X km region from your residence — would help people get off the screens and get outside in a context other than work. Similar to how In high school you need 40 hrs of community service to graduate Edit: ok not ‘enforced’ but there should be some sort of government incentive

The irony is that if you do this for the purposes of finding a date, then the efficient stay-at-home solution is to essentially just use Tinder, which optimizes the process, so we're full circle.

Unless, of course, using Tinder unevenly weights physical attractiveness and going to community events more evenly weights other forms of attraction (which is probably the case), in which case going out more could be better than using Tinder for some people.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#125

Post by hansflying » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:23 AM UTC

Artificial AI-driven-wife (for example "Geminoid F") with artificial womb would solve the problem.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#126

Post by kbar13 » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:23 AM UTC

zone411 wrote: post #55

kbar13 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

porn is not a replacement for a relationship with a person, casual or serious.

Of course it's not but VR porn is a big step from video porn. There will be a percentage of men who will be satisfied by it just enough to wait longer (at 30+ it could become easier for them). Don't you think that this could lower the destabilizing effect?

Not even close. If anything it'll make things worse, as more immature kids will think this is great and feel less motivated.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#127

Post by jamescostian » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:25 AM UTC

Ask a heterosexual woman in that age range about how many awful conversations she's had with men in that age range via dating apps. She won't say "a few", she'll say "A LOT", and be able to show that the vast majority of messages she gets are either very dry or insanely forward (sexually).

If you're a great-looking guy and you can't start or hold a good conversation, you can still get laid on the basis of looks. But if you don't look good, you don't get those grace points. I've seen guys (who look much better than I do) fail at getting laid on dating apps after LOADS of attempts, and despite being their friend, I must say the messages they've shown me are AWFUL. Not just "this isn't that great", but "WHAT WERE YOU THINKING???". When I was single (despite my looks), I found it really easy to get dates and get laid using dating apps, because I could actually hold conversations. And I know others just like me, who've gotten similar results.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#128

Post by RandomInteger4 » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:25 AM UTC

abledon wrote: post #117

thatoneuser wrote: post #109

It's genuinely depressing to think that a large number of guys now has no access to explore intimacy and partnership (or very little). No one's owed sex of course but it's like we're breaking aspects of society. And I think you'd naturally find women are less able to find meaning themselves here so it's not just a men's pity party. I wonder, if this is a dating app phenomenon, if there's anything that can be done tha…

Enforced communal participation in events — similar to having to file your taxes , you just participate in X number of community events in a X km region from your residence — would help people get off the screens and get outside in a context other than work. Similar to how In high school you need 40 hrs of community service to graduate Edit: ok not ‘enforced’ but there should be some sort of government incentive

Sounds like something out of Nazi Germany. I'm all for people engaging with the community, but enforced?

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#129

Post by black-tea » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:26 AM UTC

It's interesting that every comment here is now on board with what groups like "incels" and "MRAs" been saying for years. These groups are often called "hate groups", but now more and more stats are coming out it seems more people agree with them (I have always agreed with them, by the way).

Nobody has yet mentioned another potentially large driver, though. That is the abundance of Internet porn that is available from a young age now. There are men who have grown up being able to watch any kind of porn they can imagine. Having sex is a lot of effort and not really worth it if you're already overwhelmed with all the women you could want from the comfort of your own bedroom.

Re: Explaining Sex Rate Changes

#130

Post by abledon » Mon, Apr 08, 2019, 6:27 AM UTC

anonytrary wrote: post #124

abledon wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enforced communal participation in events — similar to having to file your taxes , you just participate in X number of community events in a X km region from your residence — would help people get off the screens and get outside in a context other than work. Similar to how In high school you need 40 hrs of community service to graduate Edit: ok not ‘enforced’ but there should be some sort of government incentive

The irony is that if you do this for the purposes of finding a date, then the efficient stay-at-home solution is to essentially just use Tinder, which optimizes the process, so we're full circle. Unless, of course, using Tinder unevenly weights physical attractiveness and going to community events more evenly weights other forms of attraction (which is probably the case), in which case going out more could be better…

not efficient in regards that there are many other positive aspects of venturing out and interacting with community. Increased serotonin and feel good emotions of interacting with real people. swiping screens sucks for that. And even if people fail to find a date, which many may do so if were comparing the side conversation of how dating websites have a 80/20 winner take all kind of matching system.... the people who don't find dates may find meaningful friendships and other types or relationships. In the west its sad that 'relationship' is charged with an intimate vibe, there are many other types of relationships humans can create which can be beneficial to ones mental and physical well being.