Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids • Hacker News Board

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#121

Post by vinay427 » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 5:53 AM UTC

Fishkins wrote: post #40

agumonkey wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not entirely sure.. my memories are fuzzy.

When I was in Lille several years ago, you were supposed to buy a ticket but it really wasn't enforced at all. The ticket machines were to the side of the train entry, and there were no turnstiles or anything like that. My first time I got on without even realizing I was supposed to pay.

This is the norm for nearly every form of transit in Switzerland and Germany, among a few other countries. I use buses and trams daily as well as urban trains and seem to be checked every 1-2 months, on average.

It works partly because the fines are relatively significant and levels of public trust and integrity are likely more universal, so there are few "Schwarzfahrers" (fare dodgers, literally "black travelers").

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#122

Post by agigao » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:01 AM UTC

Public Transport has been free for kids/teenagers(under 18) in Tbilisi, Georgia(The Caucasus), for almost a decade. And 40% of the fare for studens.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#123

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:09 AM UTC

throwaway123mmm wrote: post #103

stevekemp wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Estonia did just that: https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/06/estonia-is-making-pub...

And luxembourg

[deleted]

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#124

Post by kweks » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:12 AM UTC

yardie wrote: post #24

baq wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

completely free means you have one less legal reason to kick out the bad kind of homeless.

Unlike The MTA the Paris metro shuts down at 1AM. So no one is camping out on the platform, for long. And last time I was there the controllers were scanning passes quite frequently.

It depends on the station and season. In winter, station masters have a higher tolerance for camping - and it's worth mentioning that it comes down to the decision of station controller, not the RATP.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#125

Post by rorykoehler » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:18 AM UTC

bkmeneguello wrote: post #72

This is a bad idea: The ticket price will raise for everyone else or the taxes, remember "there is no free rides"

If my experience as a kid in Paris is anything to go by the only thing this does is redirect ticket inspectors energies towards adults and away from chasing vagrant ticketless kids all day long.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#126

Post by endgame » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:23 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #13

zhoujianfu wrote: post #2

Why not make it just free for everybody? Public transportation typically has profit margins of -50% to -90% anyway... just take it to -100% and get a huge boost in ridership! (And probably save some expenses relating to collecting payment/enforcement.)

In Melbourne, Australia, Trams are free for everyone within the CBD district

Only because their card reader system was so slow, that passengers trying to touch off their passes caused massive traffic disruptions. (Melbourne trams are in the centre lanes of the road, and vehicles in the outer lanes have to stop behind trams with open doors.)

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#127

Post by closeparen » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:26 AM UTC

arcticbull wrote: post #98

closeparen wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Laws are kind of a non sequitor. Maybe one could also find better ways to motivate people to treat each other decently. But I’m going to continue funding homicide investigations. “Don’t make things livable in small and practical ways, just hold out for total structural revolution and the solution to multigenerational and intractable social problems” is an infuriating line that unfortunately guides much of San Francis…

(1) Its not homicide vs. housing. Both are fundable without impacting the other, that's a straw man. (2) You live in a society and pretending that you don't and funding nothing isn't going to make the problem go away, it's going to be there getting worse. This is the dark side to America's individualism. Everyone looks out for themselves and pretends nobody else's problems should matter to them, then look around at t…

Forcing transit riders in particular to empathize with the depths of human misery as their punishment for wanting to get around in an unjust world doesn’t cause the overthrow of capitalism. It just repels transit riders.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#128

Post by sonnyblarney » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:43 AM UTC

sonnyblarney wrote: post #118

JacobJans wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why they can't just get machines for that? That's actually what they do in Toronto now. It's all "Presto Card" automated.

No, you cannot 'just buy' a 'presto card'. Astonishingly, the 'change collectors', who only sell tokens don't sell Presto cards . Yet another mind-blowing bit of incompetence. In Montreal, not only can you buy temporary cards (with money or visa), but you can also put rides on them in a fully automated way. I will admit that the situation in Toronto may be temporary, but it's still utterly ridiculous.

I'd encourage anyone down-voting this to suggest why the TTC Subway 'change collectors' who sell tokens to enter the subway (essentially their only function) - do not also sell 'presto cards'.

And why you have to line up, pay, enter the station, and buy 'presto card' passes ... from the newstand in most cases ? ...

It's utter dysfunction.

[1] http://getpres.to/en/gateway-newstands/

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#129

Post by tzjmetron » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:48 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #13

zhoujianfu wrote: post #2

Why not make it just free for everybody? Public transportation typically has profit margins of -50% to -90% anyway... just take it to -100% and get a huge boost in ridership! (And probably save some expenses relating to collecting payment/enforcement.)

In Melbourne, Australia, Trams are free for everyone within the CBD district

You mean the tourist trams that the locals blatantly abuse?

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#130

Post by arcticbull » Mon, Jan 21, 2019, 6:48 AM UTC

closeparen wrote: post #127

arcticbull wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(1) Its not homicide vs. housing. Both are fundable without impacting the other, that's a straw man. (2) You live in a society and pretending that you don't and funding nothing isn't going to make the problem go away, it's going to be there getting worse. This is the dark side to America's individualism. Everyone looks out for themselves and pretends nobody else's problems should matter to them, then look around at t…

Forcing transit riders in particular to empathize with the depths of human misery as their punishment for wanting to get around in an unjust world doesn’t cause the overthrow of capitalism. It just repels transit riders.

I'm a transit rider, and I empathize with the less fortunate. It's hardly a punishment for getting around town. I don't want to overthrow capitalism, it's definitely got it's advantages, which is why I'm for democratic socialist reform. I've seen great transit, and awful transit. SF juts happens to have the latter, and no amount of throwing our hands up and ignoring it is going to solve it.