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To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

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Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#121
post #49
post #9

>“It’s sad, but the good news is there's a simple intervention — don't give report cards on Friday.” Yeah that avoids the one instance of child abuse but that's not the big picture here. How is it that there are that many people that struggle to cope that this is common enough to show up in this research. I feel for both the parents and the children here. If something like grades are causing the parents to lash out a…

> If something like grades are causing the parents to lash out at the kids it's a sign that the parents are struggling to cope. I think that's starting from a mistaken premise. Why expect parents to cope? Parenting takes an amount of empathy and patience and care that many people simply do not have and will not have. In pre-modern society the nuclear family made sense, but at what point do we say, being someone's bio…

Have you read Plato's "Republic"? He had some ideas along your lines. Copied here from a dubious online summary:

"""

In the first of several radical claims that he makes in this section Socrates declares that females will be reared and trained alongside males, receiving the same education and taking on the same political roles. Though he acknowledges that in many respects men and women have different natures, he believes that in the relevant respect—the division among appetitive, spirited, and rational people—women fall along the same natural lines as men. Some are naturally appetitive, some naturally spirited, and some naturally rational. The ideal city will treat and make use of them as such.

Socrates then discusses the requirement that all spouses and children be held in common. For guardians, sexual intercourse will only take place during certain fixed times of year, designated as festivals. Males and females will be made husband and wife at these festivals for roughly the duration of sexual intercourse. The pairings will be determined by lot. Some of these people, those who are most admirable and thus whom we most wish to reproduce, might have up to four or five spouses in a single one of these festivals. All the children produced by these mating festivals will be taken from their parents and reared together, so that no one knows which children descend from which adults. At no other time in the year is sex permitted. If guardians have sex at an undesignated time and a child results, the understanding is that this child must be killed.

To avoid rampant unintentional incest, guardians must consider every child born between seven and ten months after their copulation as their own. These children, in turn, must consider that same group of adults as their parents, and each other as brothers and sisters. Sexual relations between these groups is forbidden.

"""

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I'm in high school right now and they have this system. They also had the same in middle school. There's no way this instant feedback system is mentally healthy. Also, a lot of times, teachers push a 0 as a placeholder grade and parents aren't in the classroom, so they see that and flip out. Also, with the notification system, both parents and students see each assignment grade in a bubble, so it affects them a…

> Also, with the notification system, both parents and students see each assignment grade in a bubble, so it affects them a lot more than if they saw the whole semester grade (i.e getting an F on a homework assignment isn't a big deal) Could also show the average grade of the class for each assignment, to give students, parents, and teachers a reference for how well they are actually doing?

That's a possible partial fix, but I recall plenty of classes in high school and college that had a weighted grading scale.

Done every homework assignment and aced every test all semester but then bomb the midterm or final? You're still in trouble. Also vice versa - if you didn't do any homework all year, but the midterm is going to be worth 90% of your grade anyway. And of course we all know there are teachers that are just notoriously harder than anyone else where no one is going to get an A in the class, so there's also an aspect of how well other people have done on the assignment/in the class as a whole.

None of that is new at all, though. The problem is that technology has now calculated out a number and displayed it and we as humans add more importance to that hard number. To me it's similar to the whole "fake news" thing - we're too inclined to glance at what the app on our phone says and not think any further.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#123

Somewhat related, there was another article this week that mentioned kids (and parents) now get notifications sent over the phone of their grades: https://www.vox.com/first-person/2019/1/10/18174263/anxiety-... “As the retreat group started to tell me more about why they felt such a collective sense of stress and pressure, a few major themes emerged. All of them said they voluntarily get their grades pushed to their…

It really is horrible to do it that way - at University, our final grades were often released on a particular day but at an unknown time, ruining the day until around 5pm on one occasion.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#124
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed for that statement. Corporal punishment has been a part of human societies for thousands of years, so you need stronger evidence for such a statement.

Crime and war have also "been a part of human societies for thousands of years". > deMause, L. (2002). The emotional life of nations. London, England: Karnac Books. > Abstract > Describes a psychogenic theory of history, arguing that childrearing and the interpersonal expression of love impact upon the national and international arenas with greater force than any bomb. The author discusses the role of mothers in poli…

Wahahaa you reference Lloyd deMause. One of the biggest cooks with his nonsensical and unproven theories. One of the most cockeyed theories of deMause is that the warfare fantasies of political leaders and the media in times of war reflect childbirth traumas. Even Alice Miller has criticized this specific theory.

No when I meant proof I meant a proper study with controls, sample groups etc. Not any cook who writes books about his absolutely unprovable theories.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#125
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a kid, living in a time and State where that was permitted, I found the idea so basically wrong that I made it perfectly clear that day would be my last day if required, as in no holds barred, do what it takes. Looked that guy right in the eye, ready... told him it was not gonna happen. It didn't, and I was the only one that it did not happen to. Let's just say the events that followed after I made that statement…

This seems to me like a sincere and uplifting post; why was it downvoted?

I didn't vote on that post, but it says that physical violence against a child can work.

> I think when it comes down to basic physical means we have failed as people. It can work. Does sometimes. But there are costs, scars. Not physical ones so much.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#126
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is absolutely insane? The existence of "corporal punishment" or "physical abuse"? Corporal punishment as administered by schools.

It is just not illegal, it does not mean the schools or teachers are actually doing it.

Schools and teachers are actually doing it.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#127
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If something like grades are causing the parents to lash out at the kids it's a sign that the parents are struggling to cope. I think that's starting from a mistaken premise. Why expect parents to cope? Parenting takes an amount of empathy and patience and care that many people simply do not have and will not have. In pre-modern society the nuclear family made sense, but at what point do we say, being someone's bio…

> If you look at the much bigger picture—children who are gay or trans, children who date outside their race, children born into cults or to antivaxxers, children born with disabilities that expect particularly uncommon levels of support from parents, etc. etc. I'm confused about what you are saying is the connection between these four groups?

I think the point is probably "children who's experience ends up being very different from their parent's". Parenting is (relatively) easy when it's problems you faced as a child and teaching things you already know.

When you don't understand what your child is going through, helping them through it is a lot harder, and in some cases, parents simply won't be capable of it.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#128
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems to me like a sincere and uplifting post; why was it downvoted?

I didn't vote on that post, but it says that physical violence against a child can work. > I think when it comes down to basic physical means we have failed as people. It can work. Does sometimes. But there are costs, scars. Not physical ones so much.

You're probably right. It's pretty childish to upvote/downvote a comment because you have the same/different opinion rather than based on the value it adds to the conversation.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#129
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If something like grades are causing the parents to lash out at the kids it's a sign that the parents are struggling to cope. I think that's starting from a mistaken premise. Why expect parents to cope? Parenting takes an amount of empathy and patience and care that many people simply do not have and will not have. In pre-modern society the nuclear family made sense, but at what point do we say, being someone's bio…

> If you look at the much bigger picture—children who are gay or trans, children who date outside their race, children born into cults or to antivaxxers, children born with disabilities that expect particularly uncommon levels of support from parents, etc. etc. I'm confused about what you are saying is the connection between these four groups?

The abuse that they are subjected to by their parents.

Re: To protect kids, don’t send report cards home on Fridays

#130
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is absolutely insane? The existence of "corporal punishment" or "physical abuse"? According to the quoted sentence ("prevent corporal punishment that crosses the line into abuse"), corporal punishment is not the same as abuse. The article also says: "Corporal punishment may include pain but is not supposed to result in injury; corporal punishment resulting in injury is physical abuse." So the line is whether the…

Yeah. What about punishment resulting in emotional injury? All that corporal punishment teaches is that it's OK for the powerful to punish the weak.

There is actually another more important lesson, which is that there is always someone bigger and more powerful than you.
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