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Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

reuters.com

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Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#121

Post by dannyobrien »

pwtweet wrote: post #112
tpm wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data collection for security and intelligence purposes by governments is exempt from GDPR rules, I think.

No it's bloody not.

It’s tricky: Law enforcement data collection has its own, separate directive, the LEDP (https://edri.org/data-protection-directive-law-enforcement-l...), which will come into force at the same time.

Member states have argued that intelligence services aren’t covered by EU law (their management is reserved to the member states), but since the basic principle of data protection is embedded in the European Charter of Human Rights, you can argue that EU residents (indeed, everybody) should be protected. It’s just that, unless individual countries write it into their law or a court successfully asserts its jurisdiction, there is nobody to enforce it against the intelligence services.

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#122

Post by lovich »

tzs wrote: post #92
lovich wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless they are willing to go to war they can't do shit to people outside their jurisdiction by definition, if they had power over that place it would be part of their jurisdiction. What they can do however is turn off access to any resources being acquired in the EU. As the EU is the largest economic bloc in the world atm, and with the massive connectedness of the modern global economy, there's no way for a major in…

> Unless they are willing to go to war they can't do shit to people outside their jurisdiction by definition, if they had power over that place it would be part of their jurisdiction. True, but effective jurisdiction can be much bigger than you might think, especially in civil matters. Suppose X is in country Cx, and Y is in country Cy. X travels to Cy, and while there sells some item to Y, and then goes home to Cx.…

In addition to what 'claranmcnulty said, that just means that your local government is willing to enforce their allies laws because your society has decided that's valuable to them. You're not going to see north Korea and the us supporting each other's citizens for instance. If your government doesn't want to support EU decisions then the EU still can't do anything to you beyond limiting what you can take in and out of the EU

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#123

Post by jacobush »

Moru wrote: post #102
martin_bech wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a somewhat valid concern, but here in Denmark (EU) GDPR har actually been helpful to highlight some of the data collection by the state, and some of it, has been set on standby or at least been postponed because of concerns (student mental health/well beeing, was so to be registered, and stored on a SSN level “for research”)

In Sweden (before GDPR) some inofficial list of "known elements of problems" or somesuch was kept by some police officers. This was already illegal before GDPR and lead to a lot of problems and news.

It was also racial profiling. Lots of problems, as you said.

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#124

Post by adventured »

chrischen wrote: post #35

User's generally won't care about privacy, but they will care about money. What this essentially boils down to is Facebook is charging users by taking their data, which is worth some amount of money.

> User's generally won't care about privacy, but they will care about money. What this essentially boils down to is Facebook is charging users by taking their data, which is worth some amount of money.

That money is not coming out of their pocket or paycheck. If Facebook ceases to exist tomorrow, the user does not have more money in their pocket. So long as that's the case, the users overwhelmingly will not care. They've been demonstrating that for the past 14 years. Essentially nobody thinks Google is just magically free either, users understand advertising. People have been listening to 'free' radio and 'free' TV for generations.

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#126

Post by gaius »

dantheman wrote: post #115
realusername wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The worst abuser of privacy - right now - is the government Lol, that could not be further from the truth, you have no idea of the amount of data private companies gather, the government has nowhere near as much data as Facebook, that's why the NSA has programs to incorporate Facebook data, the reason being that it's much better than anything they have got by themselves.

If the government has facebook data plus any other single piece of data then they have more than facebook.

Of course FB was funded by In-Q-Tel, the VC arm of the CIA...

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#127

Post by robhu »

kalleboo wrote: post #71

> But the fact that the button to reject the new Terms of Service isn’t even a button, it’s a tiny “see your options” hyperlink, shows how badly Facebook wants to avoid you closing your account. > When Facebook’s product designer for the GDPR flow was asked if she thought this hyperlink was the best way to present the alternative to the big “I Accept” button, she disingenuously said yes, eliciting scoffs from the roo…

There is something very Mitchell and Webb about that sort of situation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JOpPNra4bw

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#128

Post by joosters »

kartan wrote: post #85
kalleboo wrote: post #71

> But the fact that the button to reject the new Terms of Service isn’t even a button, it’s a tiny “see your options” hyperlink, shows how badly Facebook wants to avoid you closing your account. > When Facebook’s product designer for the GDPR flow was asked if she thought this hyperlink was the best way to present the alternative to the big “I Accept” button, she disingenuously said yes, eliciting scoffs from the roo…

> I wonder if I could live with myself if this was my job. You are in the company, you have a job to do, everybody else is doing it. Other people share your concerns, but in the end, you have a feature to deliver and you don't want to fail your team. Some people is really concerned, they try to change things, they quit, they are tired of the pressure of going against the managers and making it more difficult for thei…

I guess they're "just following orders"...

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#129

Post by Johnny555 »

mikekchar wrote: post #114

This article is really confusing. Basically the point is that under the current terms of service they tell you that if you are outside of the US then you are doing business with their Ireland office. Since the Ireland office is in the EU, it is subject to the GDPR. So that means that everybody outside of the US will be covered by the GDPR (because they are doing business with an EU company). They are changing their t…

They have a lot of users and GDPR is really tricky to implement when dealing with any manual processes.

Though they have a lot of users in the EU (population 700M), it seems that once they figure out how to do it for their 250M (?) EU users, expanding it to 2B users is not a huge stretch.

Re: Facebook to change user terms, limiting effect of EU privacy law

#130

Post by adventured »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #75
meddlepal wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If FB moves all their operations out if the EU, how does the EU tax a company? Presumably EU companies can do business with non-EU companies without the other company having an EU presence? Genuinely curious. Not sure how this works as I'm not a bizguy.

> If FB moves all their operations out if the EU, how does the EU tax a company? If Facebook moved its servers and personnel out of the EU to avoid complying with EU law, I'd fully expect--and support--the EU to (a) punitively taxing EU businesses buying Facebook ads, (b) banning EU businesses from buying said ads, (c) extraditing Facebook executives to the EU and then (d) blocking Facebook in the EU. No jurisdiction…

What that setup describes is a required implementation of the Chinese firewall and vast Internet controls by the EU over all persons within the EU. There's no other way to enforce such a scheme otherwise, you have to know all about user & business Internet use.

Option C would never happen. Option D requires the Chinese firewall, very obviously. It's very aggressively courting fascism, practically begging for it; a return to militant European fascism would be the sole possible outcome over time. It would turn the EU into a walled garden network, which is constantly railed against in regards to Facebook.

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