Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

cnbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 185 posts

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#121

Post by vonmoltke »

matt_wulfeck wrote: post #49
20years wrote: post #18

This doesn't really surprise me. A few years ago we had lead generation software that catered to the solar industry. We had some decent sized clients and it did really well for about 2 years. Once the tax credits started going away and the power companies started killing off their rebates, a lot of these solar companies were not able to survive. One of our larger clients who was heavily funded went bankrupt this year…

I’m surprised. At the rate PV has been falling these subsidies are probably negligible (federal rebate withstanding). I purchased PV because the cost with a 20-year loan comes out to be 13c kWh, meanwhile PG&E charges 29c kWh. And the loan interest is tax-deductible.

That rate is much higher than I paid in Texas or pay in New Jersey. In fact, I can buy wind power from Green Mountain for less than your solar install cost.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#122

Post by corin_ »

gozur88 wrote: post #91
jerf wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Is this pre-empting a union push?" Honest clarification request: Do you to suggest/worry that they are classifying "agitating for a union" as problematic "conduct with peers"? (If so, I expect we'll hear if that's the case soon, with a chance of hearing that even if it's not the case. That is a storyline the media would be salivating to run.)

That wouldn't make much sense, though. The last thing you'd want to do if you were trying to keep out a union is behave in a way your employees would see as tyrannical.

Well there's two opposite ways that have historically been tried to avoid unionisation - you can make sure employees are all happy enough not to want it, or make sure they're too scared of losing their jobs should they support it.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#123

Post by eighthnate »

11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #36

1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations. Whether Tesla conducted this in a proper manner is open to debate and perhaps details will emerge if/when any former employees pursue Tesla in court. But any company needs to address the inevitable hiri…

> 1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations.

That level of "firing" is rather suspect for an "new" company that is supposed to be growing.

> But any company needs to address the inevitable hiring mistakes and I don't see evidence that Tesla is doing any more than that.

If you are making that level of mistake where you have to conduct mass layoffs, then it doesn't bode well for tesla.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#124

Post by ctdonath »

SubiculumCode wrote: post #96
ctdonath wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which cause? Employees are free to convert their paycheck into stocks. The better they (as a whole) do, the more profit each gets.

Not if they are not being paid enough to have the capital to invest. That is why I suggested that in lieu of increased pay, that workers be further compensated in more stock

If they're not paid enough to invest, they probably need that extra compensation in cash. If they're smart enough to work at Tesla, they're smart enough to invest as they see fit.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#125

Post by eighthnate »

ctdonath wrote: post #62
montyboy_us wrote: post #21

SpaceX, Tesla, and SolarCity: ponzi schemes that have a little tech behind them and pull on our heartstrings.

Ponzi schemes don't produce major technological advancement. SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. SolarCity made "solar roof" a viable & aesthetic product. All three are still thriving on a lot of tech advancement. Long-term success remains to be seen in three very difficult industries, but current performance is certainly not the facades of Ponzi schemes.

> Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology.

What "bleeding-edge" EV tech? Tesla hasn't made a single "bleeding-edge" contribution to EV tech.

> SolarCity made "solar roof" a viable & aesthetic product.

That's why solar city went bankrupt and had to be "bailed out" by musk?

> All three are still thriving on a lot of tech advancement.

SpaceX, tesla nor solar city made a SINGLE contribution to tech advancement. SpaceX hasn't made a single contritubion. They are rehashing DECADES old tech. Tesla hasn't made a single contribution. And solar city went bankrupt and had to be bailed out - just like tesla 10 years ago.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#126

Post by ifhd »

SRasch wrote: post #109
Bartweiss wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't see evidence that Tesla is doing any more than that If the lack of promised performance reviews is accurate, that's the obvious issue - it implies a labor force decision disguised as a performance decision. This is a pretty common move in e.g. game development, so it certainly isn't unthinkable. The point about total workforce size is well taken, though; this still seems like it could be as simple as "times…

Would you say 3,6 % is that stringent though? I remember GE under Welch fired 10 % of the lowest performers every year, that seemed kind of stringent. But Tesla is fast-hiring and acquiring, so seem to have a larger need to fix hiring-errors than GE. At the end of 2015 they had only 14,000 employees! In light of that, 3,6 % seems completely reasonable to me. Low, even. Concerning the performance review: would expect…

When MS fired people for performance every year people hated them for it, and their culture was considered notoriously awful.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#127

Post by Ryudas »

rgbrenner wrote: post #104
ctdonath wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recall that Musk has been begging Congress to end the subsidies (broadly defined), which are distorting the market.

Odd that he didn't have an objection to it when Tesla was benefiting from it.. but once Tesla 3 sales crossed that 200k threshold, and set the end date on the subsidy for Tesla... then Musk comes out and says 'We MUST end this subsidy for everyone immediately'. Real principled stance there.

Let me just state that Elon musk has , in fact mentioned going zero on subsidies before the 200k , namely, qhen bob lutz was critizizing the subsidies and loans tesla got, he offered a competition where everybod would go to zero subsidies.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#128

Post by ifhd »

rgbrenner wrote: post #104
ctdonath wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recall that Musk has been begging Congress to end the subsidies (broadly defined), which are distorting the market.

Odd that he didn't have an objection to it when Tesla was benefiting from it.. but once Tesla 3 sales crossed that 200k threshold, and set the end date on the subsidy for Tesla... then Musk comes out and says 'We MUST end this subsidy for everyone immediately'. Real principled stance there.

man, I have to respect the guy's PR team.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#129

Post by taeric »

hellbreaker wrote: post #75
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #36

1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations. Whether Tesla conducted this in a proper manner is open to debate and perhaps details will emerge if/when any former employees pursue Tesla in court. But any company needs to address the inevitable hiri…

Although I agree with you, you are also making an assumption that certain managers are not hiring mistakes as well. Managers can be just as bad as employees. Especially in a big company, bad managers can hide behind smoke screens by shifting the blame on employees.

I think the assumption there was more that, for the purposes of that sentence, all employees are workers. Managers are just employees that are assigned to manage people.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#130

Post by SubiculumCode »

SamReidHughes wrote: post #118
SubiculumCode wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if they are not being paid enough to have the capital to invest. That is why I suggested that in lieu of increased pay, that workers be further compensated in more stock

They are being paid enough to invest.

Then what is their complaint exactly?
Post reply on HN