best sentence (slightly reformatted): "Twitter is not actually a company, it’s a dysfunctional non-profit that accidentally provides a valuable service."
It’s one of the more amusing backhanded compliments I’ve read in a while :)
The tech sector might be evil
121–130 of 233 posts
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#122> The other thing that’s new is that they’re thought leaders who are progressives and liberals; just like most of us in the tech profession I think most people in tech are probably more moderate-to-liberal and it's that progressives are the loudest voices politically right now, so it seems like tech is more left leaning than it is. Also, tech exists in places other than the coasts.
I tend to be conservative, and I work in tech.
It feels to me like a repressive atmosphere. Conservatives are muzzled or eliminated.
It's not a healthy environment for anyone.
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It sucks even more that these are some of the kindest and most caring people I know, with better moral character than myself Evidently not? I'd really be curious how you come to that conclusion, when they apparently don't have the first clue as to how to recognize evil, nor do they seem to care? Are you sure that that's not just the image they promote of themselves, rather than an actual assessment of their behavio…
> Evidently not? I'd really be curious how you come to that conclusion Uhm... what sort of a response are you expecting that could convince you here? > when they apparently don't have the first clue as to how to recognize evil, nor do they seem to care? How are you so certain that I'm recognizing the evil correctly in the first place? Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to first question that before questioning my asse…
> Uhm... what sort of a response are you expecting that could convince you here?
Well, some sort of reasoning? Like, what do you observe about these friends that leads you to that conclusion?
> How are you so certain that I'm recognizing the evil correctly in the first place? Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to first question that before questioning my assessment of my friends' character?
I'm not sure why there should be a priority between those question?! It's certainly a valid question, but I just accepted your premise in that regard for the sake of the discussion. After all, I am not trying to come to a conclusion about your friends (whom I don't know anyway), but rather I am trying to understand how you reconcile your observation that they are doing something that you would consider evil with the conclusion that they are of "better moral character than [your]self". To me it seems like that would be a contradiction in terms.
I guess I could also just ask what you mean by "good moral character", that this does not cause a contradiction?
> How high of a bar is "sure" for you? I'm not even "sure" I understand all of my own parents' motivations in life well, let alone my friends'. The way you phrase your question I don't get the impression I could meet that bar realistically about anyone.
I guess I meant something along the lines of "reasonably sure". But also, this wasn't so much a question about your friends, but a question about you: How do you come to the conclusion that they are of "better moral character"? What about those friends makes you think that? And have you considered whether your conclusion isn't more based on what they claim to be, rather than on what you have actually observed them to be?
> I can say I'm "sure" enough that I'm considering the possibility of them getting brainwashed as significantly more likely than them having poor moral character.
I guess that goes back to the question of what your definition of "moral character" is, but wouldn't brainwashing impair moral character?
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
If a company is not making money but there are lots of people trying to keep it around it probably means that the company is making money for these people but it's not reflected to the books directly or the payment is due for later time. It's bit of like building roads that on the books may look like unprofitable venture but the utility they provide makes possible for other businesses to flourish so the roads are kep…
I’ve seen quite a lot of suggestions on here that X shouldn’t be allowed to fail by the state, but I don’t really get it. Taking Twitter, it’s not like they are a railway or fuel company that if it shut down would cause massive disruption for many people and industries. And let’s not even begin to get into complications about the state (US government) owning them. How would that affect the privacy of users in other c…
Twitter is the medium about what's happening RIGHT NOW. In before you would open the TV or the radio to get information about what's happening right now but these days many people would look at Titter to get information about "RIGHT NOW". It could be mundane things about the lives of other people or it could be an event that's affecting large number of people. If something is happening, there would be reports of observations and there would be statements from people in position of making statements.
I don't really think that a state should run a service about what's happening right now but I think that Twitter is invaluable service to the public that needs to be dealt with carefully.
Twitter's power is well beyond the power of displaying ads to users and the only failing thing is the business of displaying ads to users in exchange for money. Twitter's core function is strong, it's not a failing product.
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, nothing is exactly what I've been doing so far. I'm just wondering if that's really the best I can do.
Well, that sort of begs the question: Why did you feel you could do anything in the first place? It sounds like a dopey question, but it's at the root of a lot of these feelings. I used to feel similarly to you: a general sense of malaise, a discomfort with the world, a plan for doing something concrete to change it. But everyone has limited ambition. If you don't focus it like a laser, you won't get anything done. T…
Without getting into whether Facebook is more or less evil than peak MS, I think the problem even if an internet company is only a little evil, that evil has much more reach. Peak MS really just affected other tech companies and user choice.
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#126> The other thing that’s new is that they’re thought leaders who are progressives and liberals; just like most of us in the tech profession I think most people in tech are probably more moderate-to-liberal and it's that progressives are the loudest voices politically right now, so it seems like tech is more left leaning than it is. Also, tech exists in places other than the coasts.
I tend to be conservative, and I work in tech. It feels to me like a repressive atmosphere. Conservatives are muzzled or eliminated. It's not a healthy environment for anyone.
Anecdotally I've never seen any evidence of people being 'eliminated' for their political beliefs, but the feeling of being muzzled seems to be common among the quieter conservatives I know in tech.
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#127Good summary of the current political climate around the tech sector. To be honest, this has been a long time coming -- I've been reading pieces with disdain for "Silicon Valley technocrats" for a while now. It is picking up pace now, though... and the EU has already fired quite a few shots. "I left out Twitter because it’s not actually a company, it’s a dysfunctional non-profit that accidentally provi…
If a company is not making money but there are lots of people trying to keep it around it probably means that the company is making money for these people but it's not reflected to the books directly or the payment is due for later time. It's bit of like building roads that on the books may look like unprofitable venture but the utility they provide makes possible for other businesses to flourish so the roads are kep…
> Do we really want to see Twitter gone?
Yes. As soon as possible, please.
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#128I'm really struggling to put into words how much this recent "moral" crusade against Facebook/Google/Amazon has begun to irritate me. My gut feeling is that unable to do anything about Trumps election victory all those enraged by his win are now turning their ire against companies that tangentially might have helped to get him elected.
I don't think those two things are related. This issue actually touches both sides. Steve Bannon was looking at anti-trust issues in the administration and Trump has raised similar issues about Amazon [1][2].
[1] https://theintercept.com/2017/07/27/steve-bannon-wants-faceb...
[2] https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/08/steve...
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
Just stop pretending that working at {Google, Facebook, Amazon, ...} is the highest goal that a tech person can strife for. A see a lot of students who seem to have that as their goal in life. Also, we have to be honest with ourselves. While we (as a community) were hating Microsoft, we made Google our tech darling. Now they are ethically probably as rotten as Microsoft were in the early ~2000s. We should stop puttin…
A see a lot of students who seem to have that as their goal in life. I wonder if that really is their goal? I think if you pushed them on it you'll probably find that their true life goal was to earn a massive salary while hanging out with smart people and fucking around with cool tech. It just so happens that (they believe that) {Google, Facebook, Amazon, ...} will offer them that. I suspect there is a good reason t…
I wonder if that really is their goal?
The aspects that you mention definitely count as well, but I think that prestige is a large part of it (both in the field and among family/friends).
Re: The tech sector might be evil
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’ve seen quite a lot of suggestions on here that X shouldn’t be allowed to fail by the state, but I don’t really get it. Taking Twitter, it’s not like they are a railway or fuel company that if it shut down would cause massive disruption for many people and industries. And let’s not even begin to get into complications about the state (US government) owning them. How would that affect the privacy of users in other c…
Twitter is the medium about what's happening RIGHT NOW. In before you would open the TV or the radio to get information about what's happening right now but these days many people would look at Titter to get information about "RIGHT NOW". It could be mundane things about the lives of other people or it could be an event that's affecting large number of people. If something is happening, there would be reports of obse…
Arguably it's a medium for unimportant things happening right now. anecdotal but I see maybe 1% useful tweets and 99% garbage.