Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#121

Post by scottLobster » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 4:59 PM UTC

orange_bear wrote: post #103

maaaats wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work in a team. The team of 5-10 people sit in the same office. That way we can talk to each other when needed. Some say that's disturbance, I call it collaborating. I'm not a code monkey. I don't sit alone in an office all day hammering out code. If that was what expected of me, I would change job. So, not exactly open floor plan, but not separate offices either. I think that's perfect.

I read this as "I don't write code all day." I did write code all day, and when I worked in that exact environment, I could not do it. Too many audio distractions and distractions in my peripherals. And I was supposed to be doing difficult programming work? I have always gotten my best work done at home, alone, while you "not a code monkey" types chit chat in the office.

Depends on the work. I do code all day, but the codebase I work on is massive, fairly old (although some parts have been updated) and everyone in the office has their own area of knowledge. What the code does is also complex enough that it requires specific domain knowledge to code properly (I suppose "expert system" is the correct term), so you can't just throw general computer science at every problem. In that type of environment collaboration among developers is vital, I often leave in the evening not because there's nothing to do but because almost everyone else is gone and I've exhausted the bounds of my knowledge. At that point I can bang my head against a problem for 5 hours or ask the local expert the next morning and get my answer in 5 minutes.

But yeah if I was just churning out CRUD apps then I'd probably be more productive on my own.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#122

Post by TallGuyShort » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 4:59 PM UTC

Microsoft comes to mind? I've only been in a couple of buildings in the Seattle campus, but it was the typical open-air shared desks that you see in many other software companies recently. Are they known for using desks otherwise?

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#123

Post by bdavisx » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:02 PM UTC

sizzzzlerz wrote: post #110

My 600-person company, a wholly-owned part of a much, much larger national multi-billion dollar company has single or double private offices, with doors, for the entire staff, new hires, IT, admin, everyone, at our headquarters in SV as well as our smaller, satellite offices. AFAIK, there is no plan to change this. If, however, our current lease isn't renewed and the company moves, all bets are off. I've heard rumors…

You might want to "name and not-shame" them, some people want to know because they want to work for companies like this.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#124

Post by TallGuyShort » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:02 PM UTC

fredley wrote: post #89

mooreds wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remote work is great for so many reasons. Off the top of my head: For the company: * less office space expense * bigger talent pool * low cost benefit * increased documentation * encourages the trend towards outcome based management (as opposed to butts in seats) For the programmer: * more control over their work environment * more control over their time * no "commuting" subsidy for their employers * arbitrage paysc…

I'd list working vacations as a downside. Proper time off, and the expectation that when you are on vacation you are on vacation is really important. I work 1-2 days a week from home and it's a great balance. It gives me time to really get stuck into things with minimal distraction, and be more flexible with time. That said, the days in the office are really useful too - nothing beats sitting with other people physic…

I take proper vacations, too, but it's when I actually need a vacation only. For certain events I have to travel somewhere, but don't or can't necessarily participate in something the whole time. I can still be there, still be productive, and I miss neither work nor the event. More time to spend on actual vacations when I do want to disconnect for a week or more at a time.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#125

Post by taternuts » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:02 PM UTC

52-6F-62 wrote: post #56

qnk wrote: post #15

Stack Overflow has blogged about their private offices for developers many times before. This is a post from 2015, I'm not sure if that's still the case: https://stackoverflow.blog/2015/01/16/why-we-still-believe-i...

Colour me green with envy. I'm working in one of those fabled "cubical farms" mentioned in the post. Half of the company has gone full open office, and the laggers (who didn't get redone before the last CEO suddenly quit) seem to not be changing. I could wander elsewhere in the building to work once in a while, but eventually people would start questioning where I am.. and I'd be missing out on my single monitor and…

A lot of people would be jealous of your cubicle setup, including me. If your company decides to update their '30 year outdated office structure', you'd most likely be stripped of your cubicle and have no real private space. I'd venture a guess that you'd curse yourself for taking your precious cube for granted.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#126

Post by TallGuyShort » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:04 PM UTC

mooreds wrote: post #96

maxxxxx wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with remote work is that you need very competent managers who understand the work deeply and can keep things together. From my experience there are not too many managers who can lead a remote team competently.

Sorry, I don't understand why competent management is required for remote work but not for non-remote work. Is there some advantage for onsite work in terms of management? In my experience, incompetent management won't do a good job of leading a team in any circumstances (remote or non remote).

It's not a 100% difference, but there are different dynamics to almost constant face to face communication. Some management styles would have a problem. Similarly, a remote manager might have their work cut out for them moving into a more traditional in-the-office company. But there are different workflows, different subtle problems to notice, etc.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#127

Post by mooreds » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:05 PM UTC

maxxxxx wrote: post #106

mooreds wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I don't understand why competent management is required for remote work but not for non-remote work. Is there some advantage for onsite work in terms of management? In my experience, incompetent management won't do a good job of leading a team in any circumstances (remote or non remote).

Incompetent management is always a problem but in remote teams it's even worse. With onsite teams the manager can at least track attendance and can generally see if people are doing some work. With remote teams your only measure is the output of people and that's very hard to judge if you are not competent. I think you also need to hire differently for remote. People need to be self-motivated and self-sufficient.

> I think you also need to hire differently for remote. People need to be self-motivated and self-sufficient.

I think this is true, but I think that most hiring managers would prefer to hire for self-motivated and self-sufficient regardless of the role location. But maybe I'm too optimistic.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#128

Post by bdavisx » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:06 PM UTC

onion2k wrote: post #12

jtmarmon wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if you live in NYC where a coworking membership is around $500 a month and an office $1000?

It's contribution; it's not supposed to cover the full cost.

If it's your employer, they should be paying for the entire cost of your office.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#129

Post by orange_bear » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:14 PM UTC

Thanks for the info! At my last workplace (Apple), the department had brought in a ton of H1B visa workers from body shops and I'm skeptical about if it was legal. They were all crammed elbow-to-elbow in bullpen cubicles. As a contractor at the time, I sat on a bench in the hallway because there were no free bullpen cubes!! The bathroom urinals always had pools of urine beneath them, due (in part) to excessive use. The toilet seats were always urinated on. Oh, good times.

Re: Ask HN: Which companies give programmers offices?

#130

Post by nfriedly » Thu, Aug 10, 2017, 5:17 PM UTC

Jach wrote: post #109

nfriedly wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still occasionally sad that I bombed an interview at SO a while back. I had prepped for more of a front-end/full stack JS role, and got asked a series of low-level data structure questions. I thought I did alright given the circumstances (I did work out the correct answer to each one), but the interviewer wasn't impressed. I asked for a do-over and they said no. Oh well...

Typically companies will let you 'do-over'/re-apply in 6-12 months, so there's still hope!

Haha, yea, but I ended up at IBM Watson, which has been a pretty good gig so far. (It was a little better before they flip-flopped on remote, but that hasn't affected me as much as I thought it would.)