So how about making investors explicitly state that they are not US persons?
https://www.bitcoinsuisse.ch/ has emerged as the goto service for id verification of ICO investors, and is used to block US investors when required.
Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
121–130 of 215 posts
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
When you say "this" will all come crashing down and "this" is not sustainable, what exactly are you referring to?
Probably ICO's as a stable 'investment' vehicle in it's current form, as the market will eventually correct itself to match the real underlying value. That doesn't mean there isn't a ton of real value being generated here or that it doesn't have the potential to be at the scale it is now. It just might be too much, far too soon. Building companies and innovating is hard, flooding capital to it will boost the value ge…
> Too much money can actually hurt some companies chances.
And you can't really emphasise this too much when the company is a couple of developers, a handful of lines of code and an idea expressed on a WordPress marketing site, and complete strangers are chucking coins that can be converted to tens of millions of dollars of hard currency in return for a token conferring no rights whatsoever, because blockchain > legal systems that actually enforce fiduciary duties. Investors are usually keen to ensure founders can't just convert investments greater than "fuck you money" level into into yachts. But some ICO founders have already got a lot more, and even if they start with nothing but good intentions, they must wonder why they'd bother spending it building a company that in all probability won't be worth more to them.
I'd buy the yacht too.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
Beware that: “The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.” (John Maynard Keynes) Especially relevant to short selling
Shorting has got to be the dumbest way to invest. With a normal investment there is a ceiling to how much you can lose (the amount you invested) but there is no ceiling to how much you can gain. The complete opposite is true for shorting, not a bet I would make on any certainty level.
You can just artificially limit your losses by bailing out when you lose as much as you shorted.
You run a small / theoretical risk of getting stuck in a short squeeze situation where you can't get out, but that risk varies substantially by security and there are often laws or mechanisms you can use to protect yourself.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
100%. I agree that BTC has been in a bubble, but if I had ever acted on this hunch, I'd be so far underwater right now. There's no telling how long the rally might continue, nor where the correction will settle. The other commenter made the astute observation that the less leveraged way to make this bet would be to go long on some competing asset.
One of my personal indicators that Bitcoin is in a bubble is when Bitcoin articles on hacker news are overrun with people talking about their bitcoin related businesses, instead of being overrun with skeptics and people saying it's in a "bubble". We have gone from %90 negative a couple years ago on HN to about %50 negative today.
I don't think this particular comment section is even close to 50%. Far more negative.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#125Aren't all these people just going to be arrested?
It's not illegal today, but it will be soon enough, and when you piss off powerful people they find a way to shut you down, one way or another.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#126I am thinking a short position in bitcoin is in my near future. I am not saying bitcoin is doomed to fail but I am pretty confident this shit coin crazy is going to hit the fan sooner or later and it's going to drag the "legitimate" crypto currencies down.
Bitcoin is deflationary...meaniing there's a set limit that can be minted... once that limit is reached...all coins traded will be ones that are already in circulation--meaning there will be presumably higher demand, because of this, some are expecting BTC to go > 25k at some point in the future.
Technically it isn't yet. It is still inflationary for the next 100 years or so. It is currently making less and less over time, but it is in fact still making more than there are now. Eventually it will be deflationary though.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#127Aren't all these people just going to be arrested? It's not illegal today, but it will be soon enough, and when you piss off powerful people they find a way to shut you down, one way or another.
I think the problem is less SEC and more money laundering. Something tells me not a lot of KYC is going on.. My guess is that any money laundering that causes grief for the US (ie, terrorism) will get people arrested and put in jail for a long time.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#128I am thinking a short position in bitcoin is in my near future. I am not saying bitcoin is doomed to fail but I am pretty confident this shit coin crazy is going to hit the fan sooner or later and it's going to drag the "legitimate" crypto currencies down.
The trouble with shorting it is that shorting turns out to require a complicated structure to exist. Else you can do margin trading on a single exchange, but the actual margin trading bit is not very regulated at all.
Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#129Re: Despite S.E.C. Warning, Wave of Initial Coin Offerings Grows
#130Most ICOs usually exclude Americans. Because these scamsters know it's a bad idea to get Uncle Sam angry.
Doesn't matter.. if they aren't doing know your customer and facilitating money laundering that results in money funneling enemies of the US than they'll wind up in jail if they ever step foot on extradition ground.