How many jobs really require college? • Hacker News Board

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#121

Post by woodruffw » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:01 PM UTC

pjscott wrote: post #117

NotSammyHagar wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying women shouldn't be able to full civil rights is like saying gay people shouldn't be counted a full humans, or using the n word for black people. It's just not acceptable, in my opinion, and taints anything one writes. It's beyond the pale.

Did you actually read the article? Or even the paragraph? It's not arguing against civil rights for anybody.

This author is, in fact, against civil rights:

> Universal suffrage elections are virtually always a bad idea. The process simply polarizes the population, and causes everyone to believe in myths and propganda. There is no way that the results of an election can be channeled into the subtleties needed to make good government and good policy.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#122

Post by ThomPete » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:02 PM UTC

analog31 wrote: post #102

ThomPete wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but before that ex. radiologist will have been replaced.

Ah, yes, but the person who owns the AI radiology business, and the equipment, will happen to be a radiologist.

No they wont. In fact they aren't today so why should they be in the future.

And furthermore you need only very few people running a whole radiology business for billions of people.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#123

Post by iamacynic » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:02 PM UTC

malthaus wrote: post #113

Const-me wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once worked for a company that aimed to replace investment bankers with their robots. Basically an AI that reads news and other data sources, and gives stock trading advices.

investment banker != trader or investment manager an investment banker typically advises on M&A transactions which is a very human business where your career path is strongly correlated with your social skills and status rather than technical knowledge.

correct - it's a sales job. very few people actually know what an investment banker does. it's just selling or (selling disguised as) buying ownership of shit to rich people.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#124

Post by jacksnipe » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:03 PM UTC

I think that the really fundamental problem is the proposition that college has the goal of getting you prepared for a job.

That should not be (and IMO is not) the primary goal of education.

The primary goal of education should be to make you a better, more informed member of society. That's the only way democracy can work.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#125

Post by ThomPete » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:04 PM UTC

wsxcde wrote: post #106

ThomPete wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No I am not being biased by anything. I said that they will get replaced AFTER radiologist will which was the point here. Longer education does not secure your position.

If all a radiologist does is pattern matching, the market would've replaced them with techs a long time ago. If not in the US, this would've happened in at least a few other countries.

What else do you think a radiologist do?

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#126

Post by ThomPete » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:05 PM UTC

wsxcde wrote: post #119

zigzigzag wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That hasn't happened yet though. Stock brokers, on the other hand, once the quintessential white collar job, have been completely replaced by automated trading algorithms.

Because robots aren't cheap, at least for now. We're still at a stage where compute is cheap but interacting with real world using interfaces that go beyond screens and keyboards is still cumbersome and expensive. But coming back to stock brokers, is there an epidemic of college educated stock brokers ending up unemployed due to automation? I don't think so and that's because they have other skills they gained from t…

It's not just that they aren't cheap. They don't exist yet.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#127

Post by overgard » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:09 PM UTC

woodruffw wrote: post #112

overgard wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would counter that the reason we consider ad-hominem bad is because it enables lazy thinkers to avoid the topic at hand and redirect it to something thats a lot easier to criticize. Thats the path of sophistry.

Maybe it does, but that's perhaps not the point. The point, at least in this case, is that the author is counting on being treated as a serious thinker at the table of ideas. He is relying on our good faith to promote ideas that are fundamentally incompatible with the existence of exactly the kind of dialogue he's being given on this site. Do not think, should he win, that he will afford you the same charity. Critici…

Ok but still youre not arguing what he said, youre arguing what he is. To me, thats the dark path. It's intellectually dishonest. This is what generally annoys me about the social justice scene: its always about silencing or shunning people, never about engaging them.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#128

Post by wsxcde » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:10 PM UTC

ThomPete wrote: post #126

wsxcde wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because robots aren't cheap, at least for now. We're still at a stage where compute is cheap but interacting with real world using interfaces that go beyond screens and keyboards is still cumbersome and expensive. But coming back to stock brokers, is there an epidemic of college educated stock brokers ending up unemployed due to automation? I don't think so and that's because they have other skills they gained from t…

It's not just that they aren't cheap. They don't exist yet.

What do you think roomba is, if not a house-cleaning robot?

ED: yes, they're not perfect but give it about 20 years. I'm pretty sure we won't have human cleaners by then.

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#129

Post by pjscott » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:12 PM UTC

woodruffw wrote: post #121

pjscott wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you actually read the article? Or even the paragraph? It's not arguing against civil rights for anybody.

This author is, in fact, against civil rights: > Universal suffrage elections are virtually always a bad idea. The process simply polarizes the population, and causes everyone to believe in myths and propganda. There is no way that the results of an election can be channeled into the subtleties needed to make good government and good policy.

I read that more as an allusion to public choice theory, but your interpretation of that paragraph is also plausible; conceded!

It looks like this guy discusses the matter at greater length here, if anybody is curious:

https://devinhelton.com/2015/08/dictatorship-and-democracy

Re: How many jobs really require college?

#130

Post by matwood » Sat, Apr 15, 2017, 5:13 PM UTC

dhimes wrote: post #59

komali2 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the most elite companies in the valley have discovered correctly that remote work doesn't work That's extraordinarily presumptive. Is IBM and a handful of others gods of all things HR? Why? There's conflicting data on both sides of the table, IBM just went with one choice over another. Recently, by the way, so we don't even know it's going to work. Furthermore, there's a strong argument that the move was an easy way…

Good point. Didn't Yahoo abandon remote work as soon as Mayer took over?

Depending on who you talk to, this was either a ploy to do a non-layoff layoff, or since all the good people had already left the people still at Yahoo were just cashing paychecks. It didn't matter if they were in the office or not.

Pointing to the burning, foreclosed house is not a very accurate way to draw conclusions about the whole neighborhood.