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Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

theguardian.com

121–130 of 264 posts

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#121

Adopt a greyhound or galgo español instead of buying purebreds. It's a noble cause, and they are both healthy races in comparison.

I live in a neighborhood and several of my neighbors have greyhounds that they've adopted who were former race dogs.

Probably the most docile, loving, affectionate dogs. And absolutely gorgeous animals.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#122
post #28

There was a great video I saw about how "purebred" dogs are essentially a cesspool of genetic disorders, and how we need to start taking active steps to bring back genetic diversity in our dogs. It was eye opening to see that the pedigrees we put on a pedestal are actually putting our dogs through a host of abnormalities and health complications. https://youtu.be/aCv10_WvGxo

I don't think you can make a blanket statement about whether you can manage to retain breed traits without damning the dogs. If I had to slap down a guess on what is going on. The #1 issue is targeting cosmetic traits that are anatomically not functional. The #2 issue is breeders not prioritizing health over conforming to the breed standard. Pet grade purebreds may not look quite perfect to a discerning eye, but they…

Genetic clearances are much more common in the world of working breeds, since there is a market pressure to have dogs that can actually function in their job. Demand for working titles (search/rescue, agility, hunting championships, etc) also selects for more physically capable animals.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#123

One thing I've wondered (and I hope this isn't an inflammatory question) is if a breed in dogs is analogous to race in humans? If that's wrong, does the idea of breed have any human equivalent? Does race have any equivalent in dogs?

Seems like a fair question. Dogs seem very versatile. Dogs are apparently like neonatal wolves, can we breed neonatal humans?

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#124
post #28

There was a great video I saw about how "purebred" dogs are essentially a cesspool of genetic disorders, and how we need to start taking active steps to bring back genetic diversity in our dogs. It was eye opening to see that the pedigrees we put on a pedestal are actually putting our dogs through a host of abnormalities and health complications. https://youtu.be/aCv10_WvGxo

My family trains and breeds hunting retrievers as a hobby. Hip displaysia, heart disease and eye disorders run rampant in the breed, particularly in show lines where the dogs are expected to be pretty and not be particularly athletic. Organizations like the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals ( http://ofa.org/ ) maintain public databases of genetic clearances for dogs in the effort to combat these problems. If you want…

How do you "run genetic clearance"? It sounds quite ominous - do you kill the offspring that does not pass the clearance?

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#125

One thing I've wondered (and I hope this isn't an inflammatory question) is if a breed in dogs is analogous to race in humans? If that's wrong, does the idea of breed have any human equivalent? Does race have any equivalent in dogs?

Well there are families that inherit hereditary disease, and inbreeding has been a problem in some communities in some eras, but it's always been far, far more localised than any culture or 'race'.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#126

One thing I've wondered (and I hope this isn't an inflammatory question) is if a breed in dogs is analogous to race in humans? If that's wrong, does the idea of breed have any human equivalent? Does race have any equivalent in dogs?

Breed in dogs is a product of selection by humans on dogs.

So no, no real analogy.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#127
Folks might enjoy reading The Dog Wars:

https://www.amazon.com/Dog-Wars-Border-Battled-American/dp/0...

Border collies were extremely functional dogs, and a subset of border collie owners did not at all want their dog breed to be part of the American Kennel Club, lest they start being bred for appearance or some other random irrelevant attribute.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#128
Slightly related, I've always wondered when I look at various dogs when I am out and people are walking theirs, why some people would want a dog that is clearly struggling just to live. For instance, dachshunds, I look at them and think, running can't be easy for them. It just looks painful to be a dachshund. And there are many breeds we see each day I think something is really wrong with them.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#129
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans are apes not monkeys. What if you sister called and said there was a safe, cheap and effective way to remove, say, the myopia from her spawn (in the case of dogs, stop inbreeding, in the case of humans, currently imaginary)? Would you tell her not to do it?

We aren't apes or monkeys. http://johnhawks.net/weblog/topics/phylogeny/taxonomy/humans...

Hmm. We're "Great Apes" (hominids), but not "Apes"? That seems to violate common sense, in my opinion.

Re: Pugs are anatomical disasters. Vets must speak out–even if it’s bad for business

#130

One thing I've wondered (and I hope this isn't an inflammatory question) is if a breed in dogs is analogous to race in humans? If that's wrong, does the idea of breed have any human equivalent? Does race have any equivalent in dogs?

Seems like a fair question. Dogs seem very versatile. Dogs are apparently like neonatal wolves, can we breed neonatal humans?

Humans are neonatal humans. But also we cross-breed a lot. The exception would be certain royal families in centuries past and we all know how that ended up. Human races are a result of a process similar to dog breeds, but the differentiation is nowhere near the same.
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