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MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

opensource.apple.com

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Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#121
Oh, how I miss having a working USB stack...

https://opensource.apple.com/source/IOUSBFamily/IOUSBFamily-...

They re-wrote IOUSBFamily (or at least they said they did) and it's buggy as all heck whenever you try use a USB 3 hub (since the 10.9 rewrite).

I'd fix it myself, but it's no longer open source. Plus, to really rub salt in the wound, there's no longer a USB debugging kext. Yay, Apple...

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#122
post #27

I have been drafting an 'Ideas' post about the following idea, but it's not done yet and this looks like as good a place as any to look for some early feedback. This might not have as much clarity as I'd like. The general idea is to have a site that can track various projects that release their own copy of GPL (especially, but other licenses as well) software. So Apple ships their version of {bash, etc.}, and so does…

This could be very very useful for embedded devices. You'd be better off linking to repos where possible - some vendor dumps are gigabytes in size. Happy to chat more. Details are in profile.

Dito. My email address can be found in my profile.

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#123
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always thought it was pretty clear to say "os ecks" myself, but I've heard internally / correctly people say "oh es ten". It's hard to break the habit after 5+ years though.

Last vestiges of Roman enumeration :). Saw an article the other day that said "Part I of V". I shook my head.

Why? "Part I of V" is crystal-clear. It's the nineth part of a 22-part series, preceded by "Part H" and succeeded by "Part J". :)

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking about cool things, no doubt about it, but code made available for academic purposes only is still not open source. This isn't just pedantry, we are scientists from different countries, with many of us having learned English as a second or third language (I'm from Romania, hi), so it's better to be precise in language. And in this instance "open source" is a good term to be precise about, because the OS…

> So when I hear "open source", I don't have to go and read the license and validate that these requirements are true...... This saves me time, headaches and money. Most of us have some vague understanding about Licenses. Eg: MIT/X11 specifically says "...FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT..." but it is "open source" That is, if you earn too much money from some MIT License software, the author itse…

> the author itself is free to sue you the way he/she can (eg, patents). One example could be dotNet from M$.

That's not actually true. In law, at least in the US, there's such a thing called Estompel [1], and licenses like BSD / MIT do have an implicit patents grant [2], unless the software is also accompanied by an explicit patents license (like Microsoft is doing), in which case that license takes precedence.

Of course, you can't be totally safe with an implicit patents grant, because its applicability depends on jurisdiction, plus it's always unclear if you can also count on it for derived works, etc. But then again, this is why GPL v2 is still safe. Remember that the Linux kernel is licensed under GPL v2? So what, are we all screwed?

> note that you can trust "free software" guys more than "open source" ones.

With all due respect, but many "free software" guys tend to be zealots and I can't take them seriously anymore. Not when the FSF starts doing stupid shit, like preventing Emacs on MacOS from supporting emoji just because the "free operating systems" would be at a disadvantage. Talk about crazy.

Also, in my opinion AGPL does not pass the OSI definition and it was probably accepted only because it would have brought out the crazy, but that's a personal opinion.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estoppel

[2] http://en.swpat.org/wiki/Implicit_patent_grant

[3] https://github.com/emacs-mirror/emacs/blob/emacs-25.1/etc/NE...

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#125

Oh, how I miss having a working USB stack... https://opensource.apple.com/source/IOUSBFamily/IOUSBFamily-... They re-wrote IOUSBFamily (or at least they said they did) and it's buggy as all heck whenever you try use a USB 3 hub (since the 10.9 rewrite). I'd fix it myself, but it's no longer open source. Plus, to really rub salt in the wound, there's no longer a USB debugging kext. Yay, Apple...

I’m similarly displeased with the disappearance of the pthread subsystem in 10.9! I had to debug quite a nasty kernel bug, and was absolutely surprised when I discovered that all pthread syscalls are now stubs into a private kext.

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#126
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Apple open sourced all of macOS maybe that would put more pressure on Microsoft to intentionally[1] open source Windows. [1]: It has been open sourced in the past: https://torrentfreak.com/microsoft-takes-pirated-windows-nt-... http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1030335/leaked-wind...

> [1]: It has been open sourced in the past: I am really hoping that you were joking.

You got it. Was missing the air-quotes.

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#127
post #36
post #6

Long time ago, they used to also publish a bootable ISO of Darwin + all of those OSS packages. They did publish an updated Darwin core / kernel a few releases back, but it seems to be closed again. Too bad, I think someone with some determination could have gotten am hypervisor based container tech running on this. Of course the test would not run, but APIs shims could have made whole software compile (but not link).…

If Apple open sourced all of macOS maybe that would put more pressure on Microsoft to intentionally[1] open source Windows. [1]: It has been open sourced in the past: https://torrentfreak.com/microsoft-takes-pirated-windows-nt-... http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1030335/leaked-wind...

I meant "open sourced". I was being sarcastic. I "absolutely love" how literal all of you are. See that? I used quotes that time. Happy F'ing Thanksgiving.

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#128
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, a page with a list of downloadable tarballs can hardly be called Open Source. BTW, how useful is this code? Obviously you can't build anything with this. It's useful for auditing, maybe?

I would agree that there are obviously ways in which Apple could participate more in many of the open-source projects they use, but I don't really buy your point - it's literally source code which is open! The idea is for Apple to release the source for components that are included in macOS, and the license requires publication. There is no obligation (or, I would argue, expectation) to do anything more.

Well. Okay. What I really meant to say is that Open Source - to me at least - can really call itself Open Source if there is a collaborative effort to maintain the code, ideally through a version control mechanism.

For example, Android is not Open Source to me because the code is dropped after the fact.

But fair enough. I'll take the downvotes.

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#129

Heh, I went spelunking through the bsd/mach layers of the code, was quite a bit of fun. Looks like they've only released the x86_64 and x86 versions of the code? I don't see any ARM in there. Anyways, found gems like this [1]: /* * File: sched_prim.c * Author: Avadis Tevanian, Jr. * Date: 1986 * * Scheduling primitives * */ I hope to leave a legacy like this someday, hopefully someone will appreciate the author's com…

/* * Author: Avadis Tevanian, Jr. */ */ Avie Tevanian did go on to leave quite a legacy. He was Apple's software CTO up until 2006 and was responsible for much of the Mac OS X we know today!

Avie was one of the lead developers of Mach at Carnegie Mellon as well, so his legacy extends beyond macOS and NEXTSTEP.

But I'd argue that beyond code, probably his most important Apple role was establishing a steady release schedule. After the disasters of the Pink (later spun off as Taligent), Copland and Gershwin megaprojects, Avie managed to get Apple to focus on making small steady releases.

And while MacOS X was a megaproject, it too was released in steady steps: Rhapsody, Mac OS X Server 1.0, MacOS X Public Beta and then finally Mac OS X 10.0

Re: MacOS 10.12 Open Source Components

#130
post #73

That title is clickbaity.

Yeah, a page with a list of downloadable tarballs can hardly be called Open Source. BTW, how useful is this code? Obviously you can't build anything with this. It's useful for auditing, maybe?

I find the code very useful. I've checked the Core Foundation sources numerous times when I wanted to know how something was implemented. Apple's documentation is sometimes lacking, and it's great when you run into a problem and you can just read the sources.

Unfortunately, CF is always released pretty late (it's "coming soon" for months), and it would be nice if much more was Open Source.

But I'm happy about every bit of code that's public!

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