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Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

techcrunch.com

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Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#121

Post by dragontamer »

rms_returns wrote: post #63
Retric wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Systemic corruption. The area benefits from having lot's of Patent cases.

Then why doesn't your White House or Obama do something about it? (non-US citizen here).

Wrong branch.

The Supreme Court's job is to issue smackdowns on appeals courts, and they have been doing so rather consistently. EFF is lobbying the lower federal courts at the moment. See this story for details: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/10/eff-asks-appeals-...

But yeah, the President is actually quite weak. The President can't do shit about this problem.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#122

Post by dragontamer »

jahewson wrote: post #77
rms_returns wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then why doesn't your White House or Obama do something about it? (non-US citizen here).

Only congress has the power to do something about it - but they're disporportionately conservative and pro-patent and can't agree on anything.

Congress definitely has the power, but so does the federal court system. I think its more beneficial to push the federal courts to attack the East Texas problem.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#123

Post by drzaiusapelord »

rms_returns wrote: post #63
Retric wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Systemic corruption. The area benefits from having lot's of Patent cases.

Then why doesn't your White House or Obama do something about it? (non-US citizen here).

Well, only Congress can impeach federal judges. So POTUS can't do anything in that regard, but POTUS administers the Patent Office. Obama could write one little letter telling them to mark all new patents and all old patents up for review as invalid. I believe this can be done without the approval of congress. I imagine there would be a lawsuit immediately from various parties. My best guess is that SCOTUS would be forced to uphold this executive order.

In fact, Obama has done this, but not to such an extreme degree.

http://www.wired.com/2014/03/obama-legacy-patent-trolls/

Excerpt:

Obama issued five executive orders on patent reform last summer. Among other things, they require the Patent and Trademark Office to stop issuing overly broad patents, and to force patent applicants to provide more details on what invention they are claiming. One of the orders opens up patent applications for public scrutiny — crowdsourcing — while they are in the approval stage, to help examiners locate prior art and assist with analyzing patent claims.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#124

Post by Lawtonfogle »

nickpsecurity wrote: post #110
Animats wrote: post #95

If they won in court against Apple, they're not a "patent troll". They invented something which Apple copied. Apple has patented, and tried to enforce, the claim that they have the exclusive right to devices with a screen on the front and round corners.[1] They lost, but they're still litigating that. [1] http://fortune.com/2015/08/19/apple-patents-rounded-corners/

A company patented the concept of making toast well after toasters were on the market. Another patented recurring payments of online service long after that was normal. Another guy modified a patent to cover podcasting after podcasting was invented and in use. Point being, something being patented != something being invented. It just means examiners agreed with the claims of a piece of paper then turned that into a p…

>Point being, something being patented != something being invented.

But it is still a valid patent. Don't say that specific patents are invalid, realize that the very concept of patents are invalid.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#125

Post by colordrops »

SCHiM wrote: post #3

Ugh, disgusting. Think of how much damage that troll will now be able to wreak. With that kind of money it can buy all sorts of other patents and start the whole progress over again.

The system is already severely broken, so this wont make things any worse for individuals and small organizations. It's just shifting of power from one patent troll to another. Apple is not a traditional patent troll, in that they actually build and sell things, but they do spend inordinate amounts of money subverting the system and patenting things that never should have been patentable.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#126

Post by pc86 »

piyush_soni wrote: post #120
calt wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So as usual, Apple is lying/misleading people here. At least 'technically'. No. Apple are arguing that the patents are invalid. They aren't sayin they have been found invalid already. The TechCrunch article said "All four of VirnetX’s patents have been found invalid by the patent office"

>> They aren't sayin they have been found invalid already .. They are saying exactly that, at least according to their press statement.

It's legal posturing.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#127

Post by DannyBee »

pc86 wrote: post #126
piyush_soni wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> They aren't sayin they have been found invalid already .. They are saying exactly that, at least according to their press statement.

It's legal posturing.

Actually, they haven't. At least, as far as i can tell (they each have tens of actions on them and i can't read every decision :P).

They have been found "likely to have serious questions of validity".

This is basically the standard you must meet to get a review. That's why they were found that way.

Next, an actual trial will occur. But they are not "provisionally invalid" or anything like that.

There is literally no decision yet from PTAB, and in fact, the only reigning decision on validity is the appeals court.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#128

Post by pc86 »

jahewson wrote: post #78
bbarn wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get this. Is there some paid off official there? Different standards? Why is it such a great place to win patent troll suits - which seem to get overturned in higher courts? Is the idea that a win there will stop the defendant from trying to appeal?

It's the judges and the court - somehow a mindset has developed there which is at odds with most other patent cases in the US. This is a part of the country which has very little, so big corporations fighting patent cases bring a lot of money into the area and prestige to a court which otherwise would be in a backwater. It's a federal court, so the same laws apply as anywhere else, but there's enough wiggle room in t…

Wow.

> somehow a mindset has developed there which is at odds with most other patent cases in the US.

Different courts form slightly different interpretations. There's a reason that the 2nd Circuit is the most liberal court. This court happens to be the most pro-plaintiff patent court you can find. It's not surprising the plaintiffs file there.

> This is a part of the country which has very little

Have you ever been there?

> so big corporations fighting patent cases bring a lot of money into the area and prestige to a court which otherwise would be in a backwater.

Do you think Apple fighting a court case floods money down the street like a river?

> the jury is so biased

Make whatever claims you want about the court, but if as you claim this area is a backwater with nothing going for it, how exactly is the local populace educated enough about the finer points of patent litigation to be biased?

This is a stupid decision but the mental gymnastics you're going through to try to make it fault of the area is impressive.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#129

Post by pc86 »

DannyBee wrote: post #127
pc86 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's legal posturing.

Actually, they haven't. At least, as far as i can tell (they each have tens of actions on them and i can't read every decision :P). They have been found "likely to have serious questions of validity". This is basically the standard you must meet to get a review. That's why they were found that way. Next, an actual trial will occur. But they are not "provisionally invalid" or anything like that. There is literally no…

You are right, I've edited my answer as such.

Re: Apple Ordered to Pay $625M to Patent Troll in FaceTime Lawsuit

#130

Post by michaelmrose »

pc86 wrote: post #128
jahewson wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the judges and the court - somehow a mindset has developed there which is at odds with most other patent cases in the US. This is a part of the country which has very little, so big corporations fighting patent cases bring a lot of money into the area and prestige to a court which otherwise would be in a backwater. It's a federal court, so the same laws apply as anywhere else, but there's enough wiggle room in t…

Wow. > somehow a mindset has developed there which is at odds with most other patent cases in the US. Different courts form slightly different interpretations. There's a reason that the 2nd Circuit is the most liberal court. This court happens to be the most pro-plaintiff patent court you can find. It's not surprising the plaintiffs file there. > This is a part of the country which has very little Have you ever been…

I think the point is they are ignorant but opinionated not that they understand the fine points exactly.
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