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MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

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Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#111

Post by kohanz »

starseeker wrote: post #105
cwyers wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't gotten past the point of where I just hit Ctrl-F5 and Visual Studio builds stuff for me with MSBuild, so I am certainly no expert on it. But I never had the impression that people liked CMake or Automake either. I ask this not as a rhetorical question but as an actual one: are there build systems that aren't hated, or does everyone just hate the one they have to use the most?

Everybody hates some aspects of some of them, in my experience. People also tend to have strongly held preferences in the build system department - it's a bit like text editors. I tend to view it as problem-dependent as to which system is better. If you're all java, you probably want a build tool designed for that language (for example.) Lisp has asdf and friends. My focus (cross platform C/C++ building) has led me t…

I'm a fan of CMake for C++ as well, but have also worked on projects that included C++, C++/CLI, and C# and unfortunately CMake support for .NET projects is close to non-existent (there is some, but it's woefully inadequate). I managed to get it to work, but in a very non CMake way (basically generating the .csproj files by replacing variables within the XML with the appropriate value).

As for MSBuild and VS - I thought that Visual Studio actually compiles things with devenv.exe, rather than MSBuild. I remember working on a project where I was trying to set up Jenkins CI to build our projects and MSBuild wouldn't work (because the environment wasn't set up correctly), but using devenv.exe instead worked perfectly.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#112

Post by integraton »

charlesnw wrote: post #73
robashton2 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely nothing, it was as relevant as the pull request itself.

Exactly. Rob was just being an annoying prick.

Calling someone a "prick" on multiple websites, as you have done, is massively rude.

The fact that your nasty comment here got upvoted rather than flagged to death is really sad.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#113

Post by integraton »

frobeb wrote: post #95
scrollaway wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You absolutely were being an annoying prick. The best thing you can do is own up to it and apologize. Definitely not what you're doing right now, what with the whole "jees, what is your issue" thing.

The reason he's so touchy about it is he's a narcissistic annoying prick. He only did it for attention since people pay attention to bullies, and it requires no work or intelligence unlike being paid attention to for contributing constructively. Call him out as an obnoxious bully and his ego can't stand it.

This series of comments is absolutely disgusting.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#114

Post by andrewchambers »

duaneb wrote: post #68
akoeplinger wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of those two is my fork and yes I did it to fix something, but edandersen's point was more geared towards a real fork (i.e. something that takes the project into a different direction) instead of the fork that GitHub requires to send a PR. I agree with him, we already have a bunch of popular .NET build tools other than MSBuild like FAKE, basing one off of MSBuild doesn't seem to add a lot of value imho.

I mean, it's not like people are forking gcc daily. Not all open source is valuable because of the forks.

People committing to gcc probably have workflows that predate github. I think there are many "forks" that are just done as fixes on a local machine then sent directly as a patch.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#115

Post by blawa »

edandersen wrote: post #5

Nobody is seriously going to fork this and create their own port of MSBuild, possibly one of the most mocked and reviled parts of the .NET ecosystem. I do however congratulate the ground level MS staffers on the effort it likely took to convice the Risk and Legal departments that open sourcing something like this won't make their business fail. That must have been trying.

Typical 'let me mock this because hating on MS on HN is cool'

Can you name one build system that people like, and concretely compare how its better than MSBuild, please? Once you do that, please feel free to omit the perfunctory thank you to look unbiased.

Also, this would now be community developed, let me know your github handle and I'll see what contributions you made to make it better (oh wait, that would require actual work and give you 0 internet points)

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#116

Post by zaphar »

cwyers wrote: post #37
maxlybbert wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah; I've had to deal with MSBuild, and I've never really liked it. I have to assume that the big motivation was that they'd prefer to port MSBuild to OS X and Linux than to port MS solution files and MS project files to CMake, Automake, or some other build system.

I haven't gotten past the point of where I just hit Ctrl-F5 and Visual Studio builds stuff for me with MSBuild, so I am certainly no expert on it. But I never had the impression that people liked CMake or Automake either. I ask this not as a rhetorical question but as an actual one: are there build systems that aren't hated, or does everyone just hate the one they have to use the most?

There is exactly one build system I have ever liked. It was the one they used at Google. Unfortunately it's not available outside of Google so I don't get to use it now.

However if it ever became available outside of Google then I would use it absolutely everywhere.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#117

Post by integraton »

blawa wrote: post #115
edandersen wrote: post #5

Nobody is seriously going to fork this and create their own port of MSBuild, possibly one of the most mocked and reviled parts of the .NET ecosystem. I do however congratulate the ground level MS staffers on the effort it likely took to convice the Risk and Legal departments that open sourcing something like this won't make their business fail. That must have been trying.

Typical 'let me mock this because hating on MS on HN is cool' Can you name one build system that people like, and concretely compare how its better than MSBuild, please? Once you do that, please feel free to omit the perfunctory thank you to look unbiased. Also, this would now be community developed, let me know your github handle and I'll see what contributions you made to make it better (oh wait, that would require…

Given the abuse and name-calling directed at another person further down in this thread posting under his real name, combined with the persistent attacks on any comment that is perceived to be in any way a criticism of Microsoft, I can't imagine why anyone would ever post under their real name around Microsoft fans.

Edit: I'm just going to point out that even this comment has been downvoted https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9230140

I'm not sure what you guys think this kind of nasty behavior benefits you or your favorite company, or why you believe people don't notice and aren't going to do something about it.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#118

Post by burnstek »

robashton2 wrote: post #75
charlesnw wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Rob was just being an annoying prick.

Jees, what is your issue seriously? It's all just a bit of fun; there is no need to get directly insulting over it.

Most professional developers will view this as a shameful and classless move on your part.

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#119

Post by [deleted] »

integraton wrote: post #113
frobeb wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason he's so touchy about it is he's a narcissistic annoying prick. He only did it for attention since people pay attention to bullies, and it requires no work or intelligence unlike being paid attention to for contributing constructively. Call him out as an obnoxious bully and his ego can't stand it.

This series of comments is absolutely disgusting.

[deleted]

Re: MSBuild is now open source on GitHub

#120

Post by blawa »

integraton wrote: post #117
blawa wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Typical 'let me mock this because hating on MS on HN is cool' Can you name one build system that people like, and concretely compare how its better than MSBuild, please? Once you do that, please feel free to omit the perfunctory thank you to look unbiased. Also, this would now be community developed, let me know your github handle and I'll see what contributions you made to make it better (oh wait, that would require…

Given the abuse and name-calling directed at another person further down in this thread posting under his real name, combined with the persistent attacks on any comment that is perceived to be in any way a criticism of Microsoft, I can't imagine why anyone would ever post under their real name around Microsoft fans. Edit: I'm just going to point out that even this comment has been downvoted https://news.ycombinator.c…

Please don't divert my comment. His argument was wrong, it doesn't matter who he's mocking.
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