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BitPay and PayPal

blog.bitpay.com

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Re: BitPay and PayPal

#111

Post by tacotime »

aianus wrote: post #83
jarek wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a nice list of things most consumers won't be doing. That's not to say there's no value for people who do need it, but it does not suggest Bitcoin will become hugely valuable like Visa. > - Buying things that people would be unwilling to sell to you with existing payment methods due to fraud risks. One legal example: iPhone purchases shipped to Nigeria. Small global market share for legal uses. > - Buying thin…

> Small global market share for legal uses. How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. > Most non-US residents can do bank transfers as fast as Bitcoin or will be able to Real Soon Now. I disagree, most non-US residents in the world don't even have bank accounts . Not to mention, the US and Canada are a huge market with a terrible banking system that refuses to modernize. > So like 5%? 5…

> A fringe here and a fringe there and pretty soon you have a whole robe.

I love you

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#112

Post by aianus »

awt wrote: post #66
danbruc wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it is only free as long as mining new blocks covers the costs of running the network, after that you will have to pay fees.

Agreed. Bitcoin is not competitive for small transactions. Given the average transaction confirmation time of 7 minutes (which will never go down) it clearly was not meant to be.

Once the major mining pools receive the transaction, it's very unlikely to be double-spent. If you try to purchase something online from a merchant accepting Bitcoin via Coinbase or Bitpay, you'll notice the transaction completes almost instantaneously.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#113

Post by danbruc »

drcross wrote: post #102
jbooth wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wha?? How is something that flips up and down by several hundred percent over a given quarter-year going to 'align the exchange amount of currencies with real market value'? What does that even mean? Like the billion-dollar currency trading industry isn't doing that already, we need one more currency to get it just right?

As the pool of liquidity increases the price volatility decreases. When you compare the early charts to now there are smaller RELATIVE price swings.

But that is a chicken egg problem - with large price fluctuations no mass adoption, without mass adoption large price fluctuations. And except in comparison to the very early days (2011 and before) the price fluctuations did not get smaller over time.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#114

Post by bobbles »

rcraft wrote: post #7

Is paypal just ignoring the IRS' recent guidelines that bitcoin is treated as property? From http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-25/bitcoin-is-property... : Today’s IRS guidance will provide certainty for Bitcoin investors, along with income-tax liability that wasn’t specified before. Purchasing a $2 cup of coffee with Bitcoins bought for $1 would trigger $1 in capital gains for the coffee drinker and $2 of gross i…

The Australian government is expecting bitcoin users to report for EVERY transaction, how much it was, to which address, and for WHAT.

Imagine if they had that kind of need on cash or even electronic bank transactions.

No way in hell that theyd even be able to look at all the data they'd receive at tax time.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#115

Post by appleflaxen »

Nothing could make me less interested in BitPay. PayPal is just such a negative connotation in my mind that it turns me off of a business partner just to know they are collaborating.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#116

Post by awt »

notahacker wrote: post #85
awt wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people don't yet understand how infungible the USD is becoming. Argentenians and Venezuelans understand the infungibility of their national currencies much better than Americans do theirs. Wealthy Americans and the wealthy of other nationalities who travel understand it better than those with little savings who are largely bound to their own states. Only big players and those on the fringes of society notice the…

Funnily enough the Venezuelans and Argentinians solve the infungibility of their national currencies with US dollar-denominated offshore accounts. The US dollar is also the national currency of two other Latin American countries. Call me an extremist if you like, but I think the US is more likely to regulate Bitcoin into near irrelevance (guess what, AML laws can be applied to exchanges and Silicon Valley companies a…

> US dollar-denominated ...

Right because the USD is relatively more fungible for the time being.

> regulate Bitcoin into near irrlevance

That will just make dollars less fungible.

The Russian oligarchs go to Bitcoin coferences. It's on their radar.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#117

Post by mbesto »

jbooth wrote: post #98
mbesto wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will cost less to transport money and align the exchange amount of currencies with real market value.

Wha?? How is something that flips up and down by several hundred percent over a given quarter-year going to 'align the exchange amount of currencies with real market value'? What does that even mean? Like the billion-dollar currency trading industry isn't doing that already, we need one more currency to get it just right?

You're describing how BTC looks today. The vision is that if liquidity is high (billions of transactions a day), then BTC could in theory replace all mediums of exchange between currencies. Today, for example, the dollar can be hedged because the price of oil, and vice versa. So we don't always get a true value of the dollar. (it's way more complicated than that, just trying to simplify) Additionally, using BTC massive lowers the barrier to exchange money (i.e. you don't need a bank). Banks make a lot of money (ever seen a "transaction fee"?) by simply moving money around.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#118

Post by grinnbearit »

awt wrote: post #28
sillysaurus3 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correction: Bitcoin traders were looking for an excuse to buy a lot of Bitcoin. Your eyes are deceiving you. The way it works is, they buy in order to jump the price. Then other people buy and continue the momentum upwards. Then, in a few days, they sell, and thus capitalize on everyone else's belief. This is how it's been for almost a year now. Ask yourself: Why use Bitcoin? What is the value proposition for consume…

The value proposition is not for consumers. The value proposition is for the wealthy. Bitcoin grants allodial title to wealth. Nothing else does.

And the not so wealthy since its a lot harder to buy property/commodities on a monthly salary, forget moving them around with you.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#119

Post by baddox »

jarek wrote: post #79
aianus wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why use Bitcoin? What is the value proposition for consumers apart from sending money to friends? - Buying things that people would be unwilling to sell to you with existing payment methods due to fraud risks. One legal example: iPhone purchases shipped to Nigeria. - Buying things electronically where the existing payment methods are too slow or expensive. For example, funding a stock trading account in seconds to…

That's a nice list of things most consumers won't be doing. That's not to say there's no value for people who do need it, but it does not suggest Bitcoin will become hugely valuable like Visa. > - Buying things that people would be unwilling to sell to you with existing payment methods due to fraud risks. One legal example: iPhone purchases shipped to Nigeria. Small global market share for legal uses. > - Buying thin…

Firstly, I disagree with the confidence with which you declare all of these usages to be fringe.

Secondly, even if they are fringe, that's not a reason against using or being excited about Bitcoin.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#120

Post by baddox »

danbruc wrote: post #71
u124556 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Transportation was a solved problem when horse carriages were invented. Every solved problem can be solved even better. Isn't that what most startups are about?

Of course and that is why I ask how Bitcoin improves over the current situation in a way relevant to average people.

Why the obsession with "the average person"? Remember, that average changes over time. The automobile didn't improve the situation for the average person within the first decade of its invention.
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