Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

boardingarea.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 228 posts

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#111

Post by mintplant »

InclinedPlane wrote: post #50
unreal37 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine 100 years ago, before terrorism, before the TSA, before the NSA snooped on our phone calls or Hacker News posts, before all of this... I imagine there was a guy who wanted to do something, got stopped by police for a couple of questions, and got agitated by the hassle and it turned into something bigger. Now 100 years ago, that guy couldn't write a blog post about it and get worldwide attention. But then ag…

That's an extraordinarily shitty excuse.

Oh come on.

> These events include Mr. Mukerjee becoming further agitated and aggressive after testing positive for explosives, as well as him repeatedly reaching for his not-yet-manually-searched bag.

> However,multiple statements by TSA personnel reference Mr. Mukerjee repeatedly grabbing for his bag after he was told not to touch it.

> While false positives are not unusual for ETD, it is unusual a person and their items could fail so many times using different testing equipment.

What would you have done in a situation like this, when people's lives are at stake and it's your fault if something goes wrong and someone gets hurt?

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#112

Post by late2part »

LordHumungous wrote: post #60

"Passenger was acting aggressively" sounds like something the TSA would say to justify holding him for three hours.

It's complete doublespeak horseshit.

Either he did something illegal, at which point they would love to arrest him.

Or else what he did was legal, and they're spouting shite.

This is like when the media says "The suspect refused to cooperate with the law enforcement officer." Translation: The suspect asserted his rights.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#113

Post by senthilnayagam »

ubernostrum wrote: post #24
senthilnayagam wrote: post #9

if the TSA want to screw you, you are screwed Period please read yesterdays post Detained in the US for “Visiting Thailand Too Much” http://www.richardbarrow.com/2013/08/detained-in-the-us-for-... discussion https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6276939 read the last couple of sentences "Be careful about what you have on your laptop and memory card in your camera. They could search everything. The pictures of your kid…

So... purchasing goods abroad which are illegal in the US, and then trying to import them into the US, may result in those goods being confiscated and you being made to pay a fine? This is unprecedented in the history of everything!

hope you have read the article http://varnull.adityamukerjee.net/post/59021412512/dont-fly-...

TSA Officer “You can leave, but I’m keeping your bag.”

Aditha was speechless. My bag had both my work computer and my personal computer in it. The only way for me to get it back from him would be to snatch it back, at which point he could simply claim that I had assaulted him. I was trapped."

the issue faced by Adithya was not too different from what Miranda faced at UK airport last week

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-23750289

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#114

Post by Amadou »

etchalon wrote: post #106
etchalon wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flying is not even remotely a right. Any airline, any airpot, any business period can refuse to provide you service for any non-protected reason (race, gender, etc.).

Ah, yes, the downvote. For pointing out the actual, you know, law.

You'll note that the government is inserted here, that Jetblue's determination that he couldn't fly was the result of government action. The government has a lot more rules about what it can't do to people than private business does.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#115

Post by ubernostrum »

senthilnayagam wrote: post #113
ubernostrum wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So... purchasing goods abroad which are illegal in the US, and then trying to import them into the US, may result in those goods being confiscated and you being made to pay a fine? This is unprecedented in the history of everything!

hope you have read the article http://varnull.adityamukerjee.net/post/59021412512/dont-fly-... TSA Officer “You can leave, but I’m keeping your bag.” Aditha was speechless. My bag had both my work computer and my personal computer in it. The only way for me to get it back from him would be to snatch it back, at which point he could simply claim that I had assaulted him. I was trapped." the issue faced by Adithya was…

Quoting your comment, to which I was replying:

"Be careful about what you have on your laptop and memory card in your camera. They could search everything. The pictures of your kids taking a bath maybe interpreted in a different way by immigration officers. The same goes for buying fake goods or pirated DVDs while on holiday in Thailand. Many people have said that in America and Europe these items have been confiscated and they were given a big fine. It’s not worth it so don’t buy any fake goods while on holiday in Thailand. And don’t copy any pirated movies onto your laptop. And certainly don’t buy any porno DVDs here in Thailand to take home. You have been warned. Don’t take this lightly."

If your intent was to bait-and-switch from "trying to bring pirated DVDs from Thailand gets you in trouble" (obvious) into this, perhaps you should have been less obvious about it.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#116

Post by etchalon »

prawn wrote: post #88
unreal37 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're in an airport security section, you're not free to go wherever you like. He wanted to go to the back of the line. They said he could leave the airport. But his bag still needed to be searched. He was free to leave, but he didn't want to leave. He wanted to go catch his flight.

He didn't want to let his laptop out of his sight. I'd behave the same way given how important my work/data is to me.

Which is completely reasonable.

But the fact their guidelines require his bag to be cleared before he could have it back does not mean he was "detained".

There are some pretty goddamn good reasons why the bag of a dude who tests positive for explosives has to be cleared before he's given it and allowed to run around an airport full of people.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#117

Post by asperous »

etchalon wrote: post #93
nikcub wrote: post #51

This story is told from a perspective that rather than being a right, flying and travel is a privilege awarded to those who satisfy the TSA Who cares what the Behavior Detection Officer thought, he was wrong Who cares what the screening machine thought he was carrying, it was wrong Who cares what behavior the TSA officers and supervisors 'noted', they were also wrong If a person cannot simply get up and leave the TSA…

Flying is not even remotely a right. Any airline, any airpot, any business period can refuse to provide you service for any non-protected reason (race, gender, etc.).

That's indeed correct. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 provides that service cannot be refused* on the "ground of race, color, religion, sex, or national origin", other than that it is really fair game.

In fact it is a right for businesses to choose who they want to serve. An airline that only flies costumed clients? 100% a right in this country. They can even decide who they consider costumed and who not.

* In research I discovered that it depends actually on the type of service. In California the Unruh Civil Rights Act catches all businesses; but federally only certain types of businesses must follow the discrimination rules. http://users.wfu.edu/zulick/341/civilrightsact1964.html

Airports are included in the Civil Rights Act because "it serves or offers to serve interstate travelers".

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#118

Post by etchalon »

Amadou wrote: post #114
etchalon wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, yes, the downvote. For pointing out the actual, you know, law.

You'll note that the government is inserted here, that Jetblue's determination that he couldn't fly was the result of government action. The government has a lot more rules about what it can't do to people than private business does.

As was noted in the article, JetBlue made that determination on their own. You can chose to believe the government told him no, but you'd be ignoring the stated facts in and just making shit up.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#119

Post by dthunt »

res0nat0r wrote: post #48
dthunt wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I call foul on behavioral detection. I sincerely doubt there's a way to differentiate between someone who is ill and someone who is pale and has the jitters because they're about to do something bad. I moreover call foul on the notion that there are enough of the latter set to build an effective training program to create effective BDOs. What's actually happening here is probably that BDOs are being used to justify r…

Israel has been doing behavior profiling beginning at the moment you get out of your car at the airport, and run one of the most secure airports in the world. Even though the word profiling has a bad connotation in the USA, it works. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/20...

Supposedly the Patriot Missile was protecting Israel during the first Gulf War, but there are as far as I know zero confirmed hits (IIRC the Pentagon generously thinks that a few scuds were deflected, but Israel thinks otherwise).

The point is that just because a program is thought of as 'famously effective'　doesn't mean it actually is.

Re: Did The TSA and JetBlue Deny Travel For Looking Muslim During Ramadan? No

#120

Post by jonah »

What I want to know is how he got access to the reports from all these agencies and interviews from many individuals involved with this incident. Isn't that information privileged? Did he have to file a FOIA request like morisy[0]? You want me to believe he tracked down all these documents and the very people involved in this incident in four days? Government bureaucracy works that efficiently? Who is this guy?

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6281604

Post reply on HN