Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

guardian.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 304 posts

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#111

Post by rhizome »

grey-area wrote: post #16
doe88 wrote: post #11

He did something I'd honestly never have the courage to do if I were in his position. He knows he will certainly pay for his action the rest of his life but despite that he did it. I'm not easily emotional but reading this article I had some heart bumps and wanted to cry. I'm speechless. Thank You Edward Snowden for your act of heroism, the present will certainly condemn you but the history will certainly remind with…

the present will certainly condamn you I think that's really down to us, don't you? The US Government will certainly condemn his actions, but I doubt many of the public will.

The smears are yet to come, which may be the dominant source of information "the public" receives on the topic.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#112

Post by riggins »

grey-area wrote: post #8

A fascinating interview with the NSA whistleblower, which ends with a chilling prediction of where the logic of manifest destiny and exceptionalism will lead the United States: There will be a time where policies will change, because the only thing which restricts the activites of the surveillance state are policy, even our agreements with other sovereign governments; we consider that to be a stipulation of policy, r…

and there will be nothing the people can do at that point to oppose it. It will be turnkey tyranny.

you hit the key point. You don't need to be much of a student of history to know that at some point there's going to be someone who's all to willing to abuse these powers.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#113

Post by rhizome »

cromwellian wrote: post #81

Seriously, Edward Snowden, China was your first choice to hide from the NSA? Holy shit that was a bad choice for many reasons. I can't think of a worse place to go, other than Russia or Iran with respect to the intense desire of those nations to extract as many secrets about NSA capabilities as possible. These are the most secret of the secret capabilities of US intelligence. He even boasted that he knows many more s…

He covers both of your concerns in the interview.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#114

Post by milhous »

jevinskie wrote: post #5

I have colleagues in the defense industry. There are many people who are aren't 100% on board with the ethics of their work but they do it because it is a well paying job. So, while the culture isn't entirely subservient to "orders", nobody really rocks the boat either. I am glad that Edward has the incredible courage that he has displayed!

Their bellies are full, but their spirit's empty. This is the state of our society.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#115

Post by raphman »

crapshoot101 wrote: post #95

All things aside, the naivety to think that China (and yes, I recognize Hong Kong is not exactly China, but it is damn well under the jurisdiction of the PRC) is where free speech is going to be defended? That's a guy who sounds like he will be a propaganda coup for someone.

With the exception of Russia, I would guess that China is the least likely nation to be coerced into extraditing him. If he is indeed in Hong Kong...

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#116

Post by toufka »

jamesaguilar wrote: post #39
spodek wrote: post #9

" Once he reached the conclusion that the NSA's surveillance net would soon be irrevocable, he said it was just a matter of time before he chose to act. "What they're doing" poses "an existential threat to democracy", he said. " Thoughtful people brave enough to blow whistles seem to be the greatest check on what looks like a secret, unaccountable, illegal centralization of power based on lies from the top of the gov…

I think it's almost certain the guy will have some problems not long in the future. One question that comes to mind is how a supposed intelligence organization allowed someone who subscribes to EFF thinking even come to know about this surveillance. Shouldn't the NSA be doing some kind of screening to make sure the people they hire don't have ideals diametrically opposed to their practices?

Almost an inevitable consequence of growing too large. You have to start hiring people farther and farther from your core. If you want to spy on everyone, you need everyone's help. But if even a single person isn't willing, you risk the entire endeavor.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#117

Post by [deleted] »

mortehu wrote: post #50
lawdawg wrote: post #24

Bravo Edward, and yet very little is said about PRISM at all. When will we finally get to the bottom of what PRISM actually is? When will the public get access to the entire set of slides? How much exactly did Edward know about PRISM, or did he just stumble onto these slides and assume the worst? So many questions, so few answers. Hopefully the coming weeks sheds more light onto this.

> When will we finally get to the bottom of what PRISM actually is? Is there any particular reason why you don't believe the fact sheet from the Director of National Intelligence[1] or Marc Ambinder[2]? According to these sources (selected excerpts): > PRISM is not an undisclosed collection or data mining program. > PRISM is a kick-ass GUI that allows an analyst to look at, collate, monitor, and cross-check different…

[deleted]

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#118

Post by corin_ »

pohl wrote: post #77
corin_ wrote: post #55

This isn't particularly important, but I found it curious.. > "I don't see myself as a hero," he said, "because what I'm doing is self-interested: I don't want to live in a world where there's no privacy and therefore no room for intellectual exploration and creativity." It's not self-interested in that way, really - had he chosen to be anonymous (and never been found out) then that logic could work, but with where h…

Wouldn't outing himself reduce the probability of being assassinated by those he exposed? I'd guess he's safer with the eyes of the world on him.

Sorry I wasn't clear, when I talked about motive I meant for leaking the information, not for outing himself. (Though obviously, some motives for the leak would require the publicity.)

As to reasons for outing himself, if he didn't want fame, etc., then even assuming no assassination, if he were discovered and prosecuted the right way (by which I mean, by the law, not right as in I think he should be prosecuted), then chances are that by speaking to the media first (which he sure wouldn't be allowed to do after being caught) he has a better chance of getting the public to support him.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#119

Post by jdp23 »

mortehu wrote: post #50
lawdawg wrote: post #24

Bravo Edward, and yet very little is said about PRISM at all. When will we finally get to the bottom of what PRISM actually is? When will the public get access to the entire set of slides? How much exactly did Edward know about PRISM, or did he just stumble onto these slides and assume the worst? So many questions, so few answers. Hopefully the coming weeks sheds more light onto this.

> When will we finally get to the bottom of what PRISM actually is? Is there any particular reason why you don't believe the fact sheet from the Director of National Intelligence[1] or Marc Ambinder[2]? According to these sources (selected excerpts): > PRISM is not an undisclosed collection or data mining program. > PRISM is a kick-ass GUI that allows an analyst to look at, collate, monitor, and cross-check different…

I don't believe the DNI because of his testimony to Congress in February claiming that the National Security Agency does not “wittingly” collect data on millions of Americans. We now know they've been collecting data for tens of millions of Verizon, AT&T, and Sprint/Nextel customers since 2006.

More recently he also claimed that PRISM wasn't a previous-disclosed data collection program. It hadn't been previously disclosed before; and it is collecting data.

So, let me turn this around. Is there any particular reason why you do believe him?

Marc Ambinder's article, by contrast, is quite believable. But going beyond the quote you pulled, he also has lists quite a few open questions about PRISM collecting data on US persons. So it seems to me that we're still a long way from the bottom.

Re: Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

#120

Post by acqq »

mortehu wrote: post #100
acqq wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and the FISA Court makes the blanket orders allowing the security organizations to have billions of collections in the U.S, see the output of the program made by NSA: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/08/nsa-boundless-in... It is all "legal" in a sense that there are court orders, but there are no real checks as the orders are blanket ones. Moreover, to read your mail older than 180 days from any provider a…

Are you sure you're not conflating various types of SIGINTs here? We're discussing PRISM specifically. The article you linked does not even mention PRISM.

Neither I nor you can be 100% sure what's going on (unless you are one of the guys "inside," heh) but I think it's good that now people start to care if the executive organizations are giving themselves unchecked powers.

Let's see if "it's legal" as said by those you quote simply means "we don't need to ask anybody for permission" and "every three months we get from our court the permission to do anything." The fact is that they use such arguments, let's see the extent of it. The recent news seem to suggest that it's bigger that it was known up to now.

Post reply on HN