Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#111

Post by 3825 » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 9:56 AM UTC

rdl wrote: post #92

jlgreco wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not particularly true, since when you start getting into products that could have a "veblen good" status this phenomenon becomes exacerbated.

OTOH, rich people will accept stupid limitations if you pitch them correctly. I mean, a $5 Casio or Timex is technically superior to a $250k mechanical watch on most metrics related to keeping time. And they will especially accept long lead times or otherwise exclusive purchasing processes ("there's a waiting list", or even the country-club style screening process). Poor people also get upset when cheated, but they a…

Apple had a backlash when they reduced the price of the iPhone by $100 [1]. I'd think the backlash here would be even stronger.

[1]: http://money.cnn.com/2007/09/06/technology/iphone_price/

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#112

Post by makomk » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:01 AM UTC

qb45 wrote: post #101

batgaijin wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh... I don't really get this. Why not lower the price for everyone and get a better rep among customers? I mean if Tesla wants to have lifelong customers that's where you start. But then again they seem to be going into the marketing of their tech so maybe not.

Because this is the price required to make the profit they wanted to make on the 60kWh option. The fact that some cheap low performance version turned out to be infeasible because customers prefer expensive high performance version doesn't mean that you should (or could) reduce price of the expensive version. Furthermore, some owners of crippled 60kWh units will probably end up paying for "upgrade" to 60kWh. In the e…

To be honest, I've always suspected that the 40 kWh was more about marketing than about actually releasing a commercially viable option - they wanted to hit the price point Elon Musk had announced on his roadmap several years earlier, but they couldn't produce a product the market actually wanted at such a low price. It might even be a slight loss leader.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#113

Post by makomk » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:08 AM UTC

peteforde wrote: post #52

taligent wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is ? For 2012 they had revenue of $413 million at a loss of $396 million.

The reoccurring theme in your comments amounts to: "Tesla sucks!" What's your beef? Seriously curious.

His comment is accurate: http://www.marketwatch.com/investing/stock/tsla/financials It is also, for some mysterious reason, massively downvoted. Where exactly did this $1.5 billion+ figure come from, and why did taligent's reply to you asking where it came from get so heavily downvoted it's now [dead]?

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#114

Post by caf » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:15 AM UTC

peterjancelis wrote: post #81

dvanduzer wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure there's a big ROI for Tesla to develop elaborate countermeasures. 4,750 units of the 60kWh car at $62.4k yields $296.4m in revenue. If 4% of the orders are for the 40kWh car (190 units at $52.4k), there'd be at most $1.9m in lost revenue by "giving away" the slightly beefier battery. It's plausible they'd still come out ahead given the cost savings of not setting up that production line even if they gave…

The big ROI is of course in not pissing of their 60Kwh customer base.

It seems entirely irrational for those customers to change their opinion based on what some other customers are or aren't getting.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#115

Post by Shivetya » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:19 AM UTC

3825 wrote: post #111

rdl wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OTOH, rich people will accept stupid limitations if you pitch them correctly. I mean, a $5 Casio or Timex is technically superior to a $250k mechanical watch on most metrics related to keeping time. And they will especially accept long lead times or otherwise exclusive purchasing processes ("there's a waiting list", or even the country-club style screening process). Poor people also get upset when cheated, but they a…

Apple had a backlash when they reduced the price of the iPhone by $100 [1]. I'd think the backlash here would be even stronger. [1]: http://money.cnn.com/2007/09/06/technology/iphone_price/

people confuse pretentious for rich. The Apple phone debacle was because of the former, not the later. There are a lot of pretend to be rich people out there, a bouncer friend used to refer to them as the 40k millionaires. Guys who leased BMWs and such, made sure everyone saw their iPhone, etc.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#116

Post by icambron » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:20 AM UTC

When you exceed your sales target, the thing you did was set your target incorrectly. It's great that they're selling lots of cars, but "exceeded the target" is a wholly artificial accomplishment.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#117

Post by stephencanon » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:24 AM UTC

tdiggity wrote: post #54

jhenkens wrote: post #9

I would love to know how many Model S have been sold within 25 miles of Palo Alto, CA. Driving around Menlo Park/Palo Alto/Atherton/Woodside, one can easily see 10 Model S within an hour - it is truly unreal. It's almost at the point where buying a Model S is no longer trend setting, but instead following a trend.

You don't see nearly as many in the south bay (San Jose, Milpitas, Santa Clara). You'll see them in Santana Row, but only because a showroom is there and they offer reserved parking for Teslas (5 spots).

You’ll see oodles of them in the parking lot in Cupertino.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#118

Post by notdrunkatall » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:26 AM UTC

caf wrote: post #114

peterjancelis wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big ROI is of course in not pissing of their 60Kwh customer base.

It seems entirely irrational for those customers to change their opinion based on what some other customers are or aren't getting.

It is, but humans are not entirely rational.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#119

Post by PakG1 » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:33 AM UTC

icambron wrote: post #116

When you exceed your sales target, the thing you did was set your target incorrectly. It's great that they're selling lots of cars, but "exceeded the target" is a wholly artificial accomplishment.

No, it depends on what your goal is. Here, the goal is satisfying shareholders. You want to satisfy shareholders because it's in your best interests to do so, the value of your company depends on it. The easiest way to satisfy shareholders is to underestimate (but not too drastically, just enough to be a little dramatic) your numbers, so that when you surpass your estimates, you look amazing. Underpromise and overdeliver. It happens everywhere, including with software project clients.

Re: Tesla Model S Sales Exceed Target

#120

Post by michael_miller » Mon, Apr 01, 2013, 10:35 AM UTC

icambron wrote: post #116

When you exceed your sales target, the thing you did was set your target incorrectly. It's great that they're selling lots of cars, but "exceeded the target" is a wholly artificial accomplishment.

The target was set in a shareholder letter, so if Tesla intentionally mispredicted the target, they would likely be liable to a shareholder suit. Thus, it is reasonable to assume that the target reflected all available information at the time and that Tesla sent out the press release. Therefore, the most probable event is that Tesla had an abnormally large influx of orders, which is a non-artificial accomplishment.