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Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

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Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#111

Post by kube-system »

roughly wrote: post #106
kube-system wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> let’s take as a given that we’ve got a societal interest in automobiles meeting safety standards, and let’s take as a given that we’ve nominated the police as the body designated to ensure that vehicles being operated on the road meet these safety standards Broadly, I agree. But there are two very distinct groups of laws that you're groping together here: Firstly, there's federal law, which is primarily responsible…

That all makes sense, I appreciate the engagement. I should've figured that the state-level vs federal-level gaps where where all the dragons would live here, and I don't live in a rural area, but I've spent enough time in them that I should've guessed how narrow those state-level standards actually wind up being. I get the reason for all of that, but as someone who lives in a city with many other cars around on a re…

I agree with the concern 100%. I've lived all over the US from some of the poorest rural areas to some of the richest urban areas, and it is wild to see the cultural differences in how people view transportation. And I think there's a lot of distorted opinions everywhere.

Some tend to think cars are a highly regulated option for transportation on professionally engineered roads that people can choose if they want. Others think that cars are synonymous with a basic right of transportation on the untamed highway, and they can do whatever they want as long as they have a plate on it.

But there's multiple realities in this country. Unfortunately, a new car that meets the latest safety standards is essentially reserved for the upper middle class. The lower middle class is driving used cars that met safety standards of a decade ago, with worn parts that may or may not get inspected before they fail. And the working poor are either struggling to afford rent in a city with public transport, or they're struggling to keep a 15-25 year old car functional, let alone compliant or safe.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#112

Post by lazide »

wat10000 wrote: post #110
lazide wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really, in the way you are using it. Only in specific edge cases and definitions, which I’m guessing you don’t know. And calling it ‘illegal’ is a stretch in 95% of them. Generally worst case any evidence gathered would just be inadmissible. After all, even if not a legal stop/detention, that doesn’t mean they committed a crime by doing it. But tell me, do you think any of these officers would have struggled to c…

You've now completely shifted from "unusual behavior is sufficient justification to detain someone and this is necessary for 99% of real traffic stops" to "the police can usually come up with probable cause if they want." Which I completely agree with. But that's a very different statement. If a cop saw someone hiding in my bushes at 2AM, that strikes me as reason to think that the person is trespassing if not worse,…

Shifted? Not at all. Merely articulated the specific mechanisms.

As you note - my original point stands, and is correct.

It’s difficult to come up with ‘weird’ or ‘suspicious’ behavior that isn’t going to be reasonable suspicion of something, and that is by design.

Or we could just go to disturbing the peace or loitering eh?

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#113

Post by roughly »

kube-system wrote: post #111
roughly wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That all makes sense, I appreciate the engagement. I should've figured that the state-level vs federal-level gaps where where all the dragons would live here, and I don't live in a rural area, but I've spent enough time in them that I should've guessed how narrow those state-level standards actually wind up being. I get the reason for all of that, but as someone who lives in a city with many other cars around on a re…

I agree with the concern 100%. I've lived all over the US from some of the poorest rural areas to some of the richest urban areas, and it is wild to see the cultural differences in how people view transportation. And I think there's a lot of distorted opinions everywhere. Some tend to think cars are a highly regulated option for transportation on professionally engineered roads that people can choose if they want. Ot…

Yeah, and in urban areas in particular, that exacerbates the “DWB” problem that feeds into all the other problems that make being poor so goddamn expensive.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#115

Post by wat10000 »

lazide wrote: post #112
wat10000 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've now completely shifted from "unusual behavior is sufficient justification to detain someone and this is necessary for 99% of real traffic stops" to "the police can usually come up with probable cause if they want." Which I completely agree with. But that's a very different statement. If a cop saw someone hiding in my bushes at 2AM, that strikes me as reason to think that the person is trespassing if not worse,…

Shifted? Not at all. Merely articulated the specific mechanisms. As you note - my original point stands, and is correct. It’s difficult to come up with ‘weird’ or ‘suspicious’ behavior that isn’t going to be reasonable suspicion of something, and that is by design. Or we could just go to disturbing the peace or loitering eh?

It's trivial. Playing the bagpipes while riding a unicycle. Very weird and unusual but not reasonable suspicion of anything.

I'm happy to come up with a dozen more if you lack imagination.

Similarly, there's plenty of non-weird, non-unusual behavior that legally justifies a traffic stop, such as exceeding the speed limit or rolling through a stop sign.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#116

Post by lazide »

wat10000 wrote: post #115
lazide wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shifted? Not at all. Merely articulated the specific mechanisms. As you note - my original point stands, and is correct. It’s difficult to come up with ‘weird’ or ‘suspicious’ behavior that isn’t going to be reasonable suspicion of something, and that is by design. Or we could just go to disturbing the peace or loitering eh?

It's trivial. Playing the bagpipes while riding a unicycle. Very weird and unusual but not reasonable suspicion of anything. I'm happy to come up with a dozen more if you lack imagination. Similarly, there's plenty of non-weird, non-unusual behavior that legally justifies a traffic stop, such as exceeding the speed limit or rolling through a stop sign.

Have you ever tried it in public, except in perhaps a college town or another handful of special places or circumstances?

Because you’d definitely get threatened with disturbing the peace, entertaining without a license, or be evaluated for public intoxication or drug use anywhere else.

People generally get speeding or traffic tickets when they stick out.

You have this weird overconfident naïveté about how the world actually works. Let me guess, 20 something white male, college educated, lives in SF or NYC? Loving parents who are still together?

How many did I get?

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#117

Post by Suppafly »

kube-system wrote: post #80
TomK32 wrote: post #74

He should keep a log book for his police encounters, categorized by ticket with every cop putting their name and number into it so he can show the cops how often they waste everybody's time...

Do you think that would change their mind? An officer who thinks it is okay to pull over the banana car just to take a look at it probably would not blame any other officer for doing it.

I don't know why cops think it's ok to randomly pull over cars just to look at them. They cause a ton of legal liability for their cities and departments by doing it, luckily most people with cool or interesting cars don't seem to mind too much.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#118

Post by HDBaseT »

Suppafly wrote: post #117
kube-system wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think that would change their mind? An officer who thinks it is okay to pull over the banana car just to take a look at it probably would not blame any other officer for doing it.

I don't know why cops think it's ok to randomly pull over cars just to look at them. They cause a ton of legal liability for their cities and departments by doing it, luckily most people with cool or interesting cars don't seem to mind too much.

I drive a non-sporty sedan from early 2000s. It isn't a "cool" car by any means, although due to various reasons, I drive around typically at 1 AM.

Over the 5 years I've been driving. I've been pulled over maybe 30 times. In Australia they always collect a sample of your breath, ask where your heading, sometimes a drug test.

I've never been pulled over for any driving infringement. It has always been because 1AM is "suspicious".

It is a waste of my time and their time. We have neighbors who just moved in and every item was stolen in the house on the week of their move in. They called the police and not a single police officer showed up at the house. None of their items were ever recovered. It's hard to have respect for police when they try their hardest to not do anything which requires an ounce of thinking or investigating.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#119

Post by aidenn0 »

qingcharles wrote: post #99
gacgacgac wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cops pulling someone over is never "fun and whimsy".

I had a car that was pulled over dozens of times so the cops could take pics with it. Most of the time it was cool. Two times pissed me off: one time a cop had just pulled me over on the highway for a pic, okay cool, I pull back onto the highway and went maybe a mile before I was pulled over a second time by his buddy. Other time I was just rolling into LA for a comic con, it was 3am and I'd been driving for about 14…

I can neither confirm nor deny any first-hand experience with connecting the two sides of the tracks with jumper cables in order to trigger the signal.

Re: Giant Banana Pulled Over: Driver Says Cops Have Stopped Him 100s of Times

#120

Post by TomK32 »

HDBaseT wrote: post #118
Suppafly wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why cops think it's ok to randomly pull over cars just to look at them. They cause a ton of legal liability for their cities and departments by doing it, luckily most people with cool or interesting cars don't seem to mind too much.

I drive a non-sporty sedan from early 2000s. It isn't a "cool" car by any means, although due to various reasons, I drive around typically at 1 AM. Over the 5 years I've been driving. I've been pulled over maybe 30 times. In Australia they always collect a sample of your breath, ask where your heading, sometimes a drug test. I've never been pulled over for any driving infringement. It has always been because 1AM is "…

Stopping a driver at 1AM gives the cops a better chance at "solving a crime".
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