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Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

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Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#111

At the current rate, open sourced models are expected to surpass cloud models within a couple years based on a study I read a couple days ago. Looking back at chatGPT and claude a couple years ago, very small Qwen models are basically equal in coding to what those cloud based models could do then. Also factoring in scaling laws, a 9b going to 18b is roughly a 40% increase, whereas 18b to 35b is 20%, I expect there wi…

If you have a link to the study you read, please share it.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience benchmarks are pretty meaningless. Not only is performance dependent on the language and tasks gives but also the prompts used and the expected results. In my own internal tests it was really hard to judge whether GPT 5.5 or Opus 4.7 is the better model. They have different styles and it's basically up to preference. There where even times where I gave the win to one model only to think about it more…

In addition, the harness around these models do a lot of work and changes the outcome significantly. I just had an issue where Claude CLI with Opus 4.7 High could not figure out why my Blazor Server program was inert, buttons didn't do anything etc. After several rounds, I opened the web console and found that it failed to load blazor.js due to 404 on that file. I copied the error message to Claude CLI and after anot…

> However, I'm not convinced this shows GPT 5.5 being that much better than Opus 4.7. It could very well be the harness around it, the system prompts used in the harness and tools available.

A model that can more effectively make use of the tools presented to it is going to be better. You're not wrong about the system prompt; these can have quite a pronounced effect, especially when what the agent is bridging to is not just a case of bash + read/write; you need the prompt (and tool descriptions) to steer and reinforce what it should actually do because most models are heavily over-trained on executing bash lines.

When it comes to more basic agent usage that just runs in a terminal and executes bash ultimately most models are going to do just fine as long as you provide the very basics.

Regarding your case in this post it could be any number of issues: The provider being over-provisioned, leaving less time for your case, the model just not being particularly great, your previous context (in your original session) subtly nudging the model to not do the correct thing, and so on.

The truth is that you simply can't really know what the exact cause of this behavior you experienced is, but I think you're also working hard to cope on behalf of Anthropic.

All in all I think you're placing a bit too much faith in agents and their effect. If you slim down and use something like Pi instead you'll likely get a more accurate sense of what agents do and don't do, and how it affects things. You can then also add your own things and experiment with how that impacts things as well.

I've written an agent that only allows models to send commands to Kakoune (a niche text editor that I use) and can say that building an agent that just executes bash + read/write in 2026 is probably the easiest proposition ever. I say this because a lot of the work I've had to do has been to point them in the direction of not constantly trying to write bash lines; models all seem to tend towards this so if you just wanted to do that anyway most of your work is already done. The vast amount of the work in those types of agents is better spent fixing model quirks and bad provider behavior in terms of input/output.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#113
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t fully understand what open weights unlocks that cannot be accomplished via API from a product standpoint. Open weights is great if you want to do additional training, or if you need on-prem for security.

Multiple providers of the same model. That means competition for price, reliability, latency, etc. It also means you can use the same model as long as you want, instead of having it silently change behaviour.

Those open weight providers where found nerfing models too.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#114

I was surprised by the ranking, until I read what the test was. Not horribly relevant for coding. The current ranking of all tests makes more sense (well, except for how well Gemini does) https://aicc.rayonnant.ai

The ranking of gold medals only makes sense if all models would gave participate all tests.

DNP = Did not participate

In this regard, kimi got more and better medals than Claude.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#115

These posts are going to be a constant for the next year, because there's no objective way to compare models (past low-level numbers like token generation speed, average reasoning token amount, # of parameters, active experts, etc). They're all quite different in a lot of ways, they're used for many different things by different people, and they're not deterministic. So you're constantly gonna see benchmarks and test…

My theory is we will end up in a similar spot to hiring people. You can look at a CV (benchmarks) but you won't know for sure until you've worked with them for six months. We as an industry cannot determine if one software engineer is objectively better than another, on practically any dimension, so why do we think we can come to an objective ranking of models?

The CV-to-six-months analogy is actually exactly right and it's also why benchmarks for hiring people stopped being useful. The signal that holds up is what you see when something breaks, which is hard to compress into a number.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#116

I was surprised by the ranking, until I read what the test was. Not horribly relevant for coding. The current ranking of all tests makes more sense (well, except for how well Gemini does) https://aicc.rayonnant.ai

Well, the link you provided basically confirms Kimi's dominance.

Re: Kimi K2.6 just beat Claude, GPT-5.5, and Gemini in a coding challenge

#120

In a single challenge, measured by how performant the solution was. Kimi K2.6 is definitely a frontier-sized model, so on the one hand it's not that surprising it's up there with the closed frontier models. Being open is nice though, even though it doesn't matter that much for folks like me with a single consumer GPU.

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