The linked article on evals is even more interesting.
Thanks! I posted that one almost a year ago and it blew up on LinkedIn of all places but was totally ignored on HN.
What's an eval?
My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
111–120 of 202 posts
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#112My company does not have PM for a while now. Even before AI
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
An easy correction is to only merge PRs from folks who are on the on call rota. Those not on rota can either join or have their PR receive heavy scrutiny
Nah, the rota is large enough that it will likely be somebody else’s problem anyway and the chances are even if it does land on them they just won’t answer the phone. Punishing mistakes with unpaid overtime has never been a good approach to quality. It just teaches management that they can get away with low quality because the engineers will pick up the pieces in their own time.
> unpaid overtime
Through European lenses this part seems insane. It is work, so pay me for it :) Every oncall rotation I was part of ever was paid, is the "unpaid" part a US thing, or was I just lucky?
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#114I don’t think this is a spicy take at all. A PM’s job is to prioritise, and the most important/high priority projects will naturally be handled by Engineers enabled with AI-coding workflows. The high priority/impact work should be allocated to the folks with the highest level of skill. I feel like PMs coding unlocks a whole new category of work, mainly addressing the long tail of cool ideas/small optimisations that o…
Isn’t this the type of work interns used to do? Prototype hackathon type things?
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#115I am glad this essay was on the right side of the fence, otherwise I would have written it myself in response.. Our company is currently one of countless, where we just had a "get with the program" meeting with our PMs, where they showcased stuff they had added to our enterprise system in hours and days, and told us that they expected us to start delivering with the same tools techniques and speed.. Meanwhile, my tea…
Move fast and break things. If it works well for a startup with 3 users and 1 developer, why not do the same for our critical infrastructure company? Openclaw, fire my engineering team and bring me more alcohol.
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nah, the rota is large enough that it will likely be somebody else’s problem anyway and the chances are even if it does land on them they just won’t answer the phone. Punishing mistakes with unpaid overtime has never been a good approach to quality. It just teaches management that they can get away with low quality because the engineers will pick up the pieces in their own time.
> unpaid overtime Through European lenses this part seems insane. It is work, so pay me for it :) Every oncall rotation I was part of ever was paid, is the "unpaid" part a US thing, or was I just lucky?
In the US it's common to either negotiate 'differential' pay for the responsibility, or as one might see in this thread, get suckered into it for free.
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#117Our job is done for. We will be shown the door, and everyone will rejoice. Everyone will live in a happy world where you'll doddle a house and Claude will build you a next generation SaaS that makes you millions. Managers will do the job of engineers, by just telling LLMs to make an app or to make money or something. C-suites will have agents doing the jobs of managers, and CEOs will run entire companies with a Claud…
A few points to add:
>I have my wife vibe coding programs for her medical company. Its great. Saved her $200/mo so far from ADP
>I have tried encouraging others to vibe code, and they don't even know basic things like how to save files as .html... At best I've taught them to disagree with the AI and tell the AI "Make me a file I can click on".
>Being precise on the steps to solve a problem can be the difference between 1 shot success and floundering.
>Maybe do something that involves physical space and programming.
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#118Our job is done for. We will be shown the door, and everyone will rejoice. Everyone will live in a happy world where you'll doddle a house and Claude will build you a next generation SaaS that makes you millions. Managers will do the job of engineers, by just telling LLMs to make an app or to make money or something. C-suites will have agents doing the jobs of managers, and CEOs will run entire companies with a Claud…
The end game is Zuckerberg sitting alone in his bunker and vibe-ceo'ing all of facebook.
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#119The brutal truth is that no one likes dealing with developers - now they don't have to.
Re: My spicy take on vibe coding for PMs
#120I am one of those PMs at a big tech that just shipped a PR in prod:
My take: 1. Doing this moves my team faster. I now use sourcegraph MCP all the time to file much better bugs. And when the actual bug fixing TAT is larger than bug filing TAT, I rather just do it myself. My engineers appreciate it, truly. 2. This not only helps me do bug filing but just get comfortable with code. And this improves my PRDs, my MVPs and my overall thinking. There is no way that I can do this in isolation. I have to get comfortable with code and that involves shipping the occasional PR. 3. This improves my craft. I am obsessively shipping on the side. The codebase for my personal side projects is manageable. I would love to ship at work as well but that's not doable because of codebase complexity and the inability to read code. However, traditional product management is collapsing and this is the new normal.