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Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

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Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#111

Post by nullbio »

jwr wrote: post #98

Anthropic is walking a very thin line here. The competition between models is intense and the only differentiator right now is the so-called harness that gets put over them. Anthropic needs a niche and they tried to find one by addressing developers. And they have been doing very well! What I think they are forgetting in this silly stubbornness is that competition is really fierce, and just as they have gained apprec…

Well they've successfully burned a bridge with me. I had 2 max subs, cancelled one of them and have been using Codex religiously for the last couple of weeks. Haven't had a need for Claude Code at all, and every time I open it I get annoyed at how slow it is and the lack of feedback - looking at it spin for 20 minutes on a simple prompt with no feedback is infuriating. Honestly, I don't miss it at all.

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#112

Post by groundzeros2015 »

dboreham wrote: post #105
groundzeros2015 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you using experience and authoritative framing about a technology we’ve been using for less than 6 months?

If you hired a person six months ago and in that time they'd produced a ton of useful code for your product, wouldn't you say with authoritative framing that their hiring was a good decision?

It would, but I haven’t seen that. What I’ve seen is a lot of people setting up cool agent workflows which feel very productive, but aren’t producing coherent work.

This may be a result of me using tools poorly, or more likely evaluating merits which matter less than I think. But I don’t think we can see that yet as people just invented these agent workflows and we haven’t seen it yet.

Note that the situation was not that different before LLMs. I’ve seen PMs with all the tickets setup, engineers making PRs with reviews, etc and not making progress on the product. The process can be emulated without substantive work.

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#113

Post by [deleted] »

the_harpia_io wrote: post #85
rco8786 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's about catching when it goes off the rails before it makes a mess The latest "meta" in AI programming appears to be agent teams (or swarms or clusters or whatever) that are designed to run for long periods of time autonomously. Through that lens, these changes make more sense. They're not designing UX for a human sitting there watching the agent work. They're designing for horizontally scaling agents that work…

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#114

Post by tsunamifury »

thephyber wrote: post #93
pjc50 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> blank cheque The Bing AI summary tells me that AI companies invested $202.3 billion in AI last year. Users are going to have to pay that back at some point. This is going to be even worse as a cost control situation than AWS.

> Users are going to have to pay that back at some point. That’s not how VC investments work. Just because something costs a lot to build doesn’t mean that anyone will pay for it. I’m pretty sure I haven’t worked for any startup that ever returned a profit to its investors. I suspect you are right in that inference costs currently seem underpriced so users will get nickel-and-dinked of a while until the providers lev…

What planet are you living on and how do I get there.

Yes currency is very rarely at times exchanged at a loss for power but rarely not for more currency down the road.

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#115

Post by KurSix »

Honestly, this feels like a massive step back. When I use an agent, I'm not just a user, I'm a supervisor. I need observability. If Claude starts digging into node_modules or opening some stale config from 2019, I need to know immediately so I can smash Ctrl+C

Hiding filenames turns the workflow into a black box. It’s like removing the speedometer from a car because "it distracts the driver". Sure it looks clean, but it's deadly for both my wallet and my context window

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#116

Post by garciasn »

groundzeros2015 wrote: post #95
kasey_junk wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The person they are responding with dictated an authoritative framing that isn’t true. I know people have emotional responses to this, but if you think people aren’t effectively using agents to ship code in lots of domains, including existing legacy code bases, you are incorrect. Do we know exactly how to do that well, of course not, we still fruitlessly argue about how humans should write software. But there is a gr…

I think programming effectiveness is inherently tied to the useful life of software, and we will need to see that play out. This is not to suggest that AI tools do not have value but that “I just have agents writing code and it works great!” Has yet to hit its test.

The views I see often shared here are typical of those in the trenches of the tech industry: conservative.

I get it; I do. It's rapidly challenging the paradigm that we've setup over the years in a way that it's incredibly jarring, but this is going to be our new reality or you're going to be left behind in MOST industries; highly regulated industries are a different beast.

So; instead of just out-of-hand dismissing this, figure out the best ways to integrate agents into your and your teams'/companies' workstreams. It will accelerate the work and change your role from what it is today to something different; something that takes time and experience to work with.

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#117

Post by nullbio »

cowboylowrez wrote: post #102

"Boris Cherny" seems pretty good at this enshittification stuff. Think about it, normal coders would consider having a config like show details or don't, you know, a developers preference but no this guy wants you to control-o all the time, read the article its right there what this guy says: " A GitHub issue on the subject drew a response from Boris Cherny, creator and head of Claude Code at Anthropic, that "this is…

Speaking of burning tokens, they also like to waste our tokens with paragraphs of system messages for every single file read you do with Claude. Take a look at your jsonl files, search for .

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#118

Post by hp197 »

peyton wrote: post #55
krastanov wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I maintain serious code bases and I use LLM agents (and agent teams) plenty -- I just happen to review the code they write, I demand they write the code in a reviewable way, and use them mostly for menial tasks that are otherwise unpleasant timesinks I have to do myself. There are many people like me, that just quietly use these tools to automate the boring chores of dealing with mature production code bases. We are…

Yeah esp. the latest iterations are great for stuff like “find and fix all the battery drainers.” Tests pass, everyone’s happy.

(rhetorical question) You work at Apple? :p

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#119

Post by JPKab »

groundzeros2015 wrote: post #68
JPKab wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at a company with approximately $1 million in revenue per engineer and multiple 10+ year old codebases. We use agents very aggressively, combined with beads, tons of tests, etc. You treat them like any developer, and review the code in PRs, provide feedback, have the agents act, and merge when it's good. We have gained tremendous velocity and have been able to tackle far more out of the backlog that we'd been…

Why are you using experience and authoritative framing about a technology we’ve been using for less than 6 months?

6 months?

I've been using LLMs to augment development since early December 2023. I've expanded the scope and complexity of the changes made since then as the models grew. Before beads existed, I used a folder of markdown files for externalized memory.

Just because you were late to the party doesn't mean all of us were.

Re: Anthropic tries to hide Claude's AI actions. Devs hate it

#120

Post by KurSix »

rco8786 wrote: post #22
the_harpia_io wrote: post #13

[flagged]

> it's about catching when it goes off the rails before it makes a mess The latest "meta" in AI programming appears to be agent teams (or swarms or clusters or whatever) that are designed to run for long periods of time autonomously. Through that lens, these changes make more sense. They're not designing UX for a human sitting there watching the agent work. They're designing for horizontally scaling agents that work…

If they're aiming for autonomy, why have a CLI at all? Just give us a headless mode. If I'm sitting in the terminal, it means I want to control the process. Hiding logs from an operator who’s explicitly chosen to run it manually just feels weird
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