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ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

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Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#111

Post by spider-mario »

ericpauley wrote: post #7

Some real cognitive dissonance in this article… “The PDF Association operates under a strict principle—any new feature must work seamlessly with existing readers” followed by introducing compression as a breaking change in the same paragraph. All this for brotli… on a read-many format like pdf zstd’s decompression speed is a much better fit.

> on a read-many format like pdf zstd’s decompression speed is a much better fit.

brotli decompression is already plenty fast. For PDFs, zstd’s advantage in decompression speed is academic.

Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#112

Post by LoganDark »

jsnell wrote: post #67
LoganDark wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love when I perform all the due diligence tasks. You just can't counter that. Yes but, they did all the due diligence tasks. They considered all the factors. Every one. Think you have one they didn't consider? Nope.

But they didn't write "all". They wrote "other", which absolutely does not imply full coverage. Maybe read things a bit more carefully before going all out on the snide comments?

It implies potential coverage of anything one could bring up. It creates a similar impression in my mind, because it becomes easy to claim you already considered something.

Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#113

Post by mmooss »

nxobject wrote: post #91
mmooss wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note the language: "You're not creating broken files—you're creating files that are ahead of their time." Imagine a sales meeting where someone pitched that to you. They have to be joking, right? I have no objection to adding Brotli, but I hope they take the compatability more seriously. You may need readers to deploy it for a long time - ten years? - before you deploy it in PDF creation tools.

(sarcasm warning...) You're absolutely right! It's not just an inaccurate slogan—it's a patronizing use of artificial intelligence. What you're describing is not just true, it's precise.

I don't understand your point ...

Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#114

Post by gcr »

NoahZuniga wrote: post #99
gcr wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it's not. This article is about proposing Brotli as another possible '/Filter' for stream objects, like content streams (page drawing commands). Images are streams too, but unless you mean compressing raw pixel bytes in Brotli, there's no mention of a JPEG-XL or WEBP filter.

well, not mentioned in this specific article. But JPEG-XL support is something they're working on [1]. [1]: https://pdfa.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/PDFDays2025-Brea...

Oh cool!! TIL

Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#115

Post by eventualcomp »

mmooss wrote: post #113
nxobject wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(sarcasm warning...) You're absolutely right! It's not just an inaccurate slogan—it's a patronizing use of artificial intelligence. What you're describing is not just true, it's precise.

I don't understand your point ...

The commenter is making a joke about the style of delivery of the sentence you quoted, because the style is [1]characteristic of AI generated writing.

[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Signs_of_AI_writing

Re: ISO PDF spec is getting Brotli – ~20 % smaller documents with no quality loss

#116

Post by dchest »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #101
dchest wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not with small files.

If that's about using predefined dictionaries, zstd can use them too. If brotli has a different advantage on small source files, you have my curiosity. If you're talking about max compression, zstd likely loses out there, the answer seems to vary based on the tests I look at, but it seems to be better across a very wide range.

No, it's literally just compressing small files without training zstd dict or plugging external dictionaries (not counting the built-in one that brotli has). Especially for English text, brotli at the same speed as zstd gives better results for small data (in kilobyte to a few of megabyte range).
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