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We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

bbc.co.uk

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Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#111

Post by paulryanrogers »

zahlman wrote: post #101
fragmede wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thankfully LLMs have ingested enough of human writing that one afflicted in such a way can describe the exact set of circumstances and ask the LLM how they made the other people feel, and figure out why they got expelled from the group this time. It never stops happening for us. I'm 42 now and it's happened twice this past year. But at least now I can figure out what it is I did wrong and how to prevent that from hap…

Such a large fraction of human communication is non-verbal (and, unless you're actively studying this sort of thing as a neurodivergent person trying to fit in) unconscious that it's hard for me to imagine this working very well on average. The LLM simply couldn't possibly get enough relevant input. And even emotional reactions purely to words are informed by context that the LLM didn't experience and the user won't…

> But supposedly neurotypical people demonstrate what seems to me like a stunning lack of empathy (or more generally, ability to comprehend other worldviews) all the time.

IME religion facilities this phenomenon. In-group members (esp men) get forgiveness and freedom from consequences (perhaps conditioned on saying magic words). Whilst out-groups get "forgiveness" with extra consequences.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#112

Post by m4ck_ »

lurk2 wrote: post #87
m4ck_ wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK about ya'll but the ~25-30% (or whatever) I pay in taxes/SS/medicare isn't going to be a significant enough bump to enable me to eliminate homelessness... Where we can actually take the government out of the equation and actually help people: Zoning. In places without governments like Haiti you can raise a family in a relatively simple structure. It's not ideal but it's how humans have been not-homeless for the e…

> In places without governments like Haiti you can raise a family in a relatively simple structure. The third world is not a model to emulate. Haiti is a failed state.

Might want to take a gander at the sentence before:

>Where we can actually take the government out of the equation and actually help people: Zoning

Fixing the fucked up zoning & other regs that force housing prices to only ever move in one direction is not the same as advocating for elimination of government or suggesting Haiti is something to aspire to. Insert any country where people live on a fraction of US minimum wage, and you'll find folks don't typically live in 4br/5ba houses w/ 2 car garages in perfectly manicured subdivisions that look like some copy and pasted the same house 800 times. The way they live would be illegal in most populated area in the US today, although it was perfectly acceptable for older generations.

As long as a house is primarily considered an investment, and not a just a structure to keep us safe from the elements and a place to raise a family, housing will only ever become more expensive and less available.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#113

Post by m4ck_ »

gramie wrote: post #93
m4ck_ wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK about ya'll but the ~25-30% (or whatever) I pay in taxes/SS/medicare isn't going to be a significant enough bump to enable me to eliminate homelessness... Where we can actually take the government out of the equation and actually help people: Zoning. In places without governments like Haiti you can raise a family in a relatively simple structure. It's not ideal but it's how humans have been not-homeless for the e…

Without government interference, someone who is stronger/more brutal than you can kill you and take your property, partner, and anything else they like. It is in the top 10 in the world for homicides. Haiti is a horrifying place to live, for most people. The UN says that 85% of the capital is controlled by gangs, and they are spreading out into the rest of the country.

I'm sure you're aware we can address zoning and other regs that drive prices up, without going full Haiti. Replace Haiti with any country where people live on a tiny fraction of what we do in the US, and it still makes sense.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#114

Post by vidarh »

tetromino_ wrote: post #98
fragmede wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not going to share a personal example, but eg plug "I bought my mom a vacuum cleaner for her birthday. Why did she get mad at me? she keeps complaining about the old one!" into ChatGPT vs find me any human willing to sit down and have that as an actual discussion with me as a human of any age. I'm just supposed to get it? I'm a fucking monster and unworthy of being loved because I need that explained to me? "You shou…

Without context, the reaction is bizarre. There must be some back story that you omitted; maybe something about the mother previously asking other people in the family to vacuum, and being ignored? My wife and I, by the way, are giving each other a joint New Year gift of a fancy robot vacuum cleaner: it's the best sort of gift, useful, elegant, and something that one would be reluctant to spend the money on otherwise…

A joint gift is very different, and a joint gift of a household appliance that reduces the work doubly so.

The reaction is a result of the gift implying that the work is the responsibility of the individual recipient.

It's not a universal reaction, but common enough that it is a frequent trope in movies and TV.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#115

Post by afavour »

marky1991 wrote: post #97
fragmede wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not going to share a personal example, but eg plug "I bought my mom a vacuum cleaner for her birthday. Why did she get mad at me? she keeps complaining about the old one!" into ChatGPT vs find me any human willing to sit down and have that as an actual discussion with me as a human of any age. I'm just supposed to get it? I'm a fucking monster and unworthy of being loved because I need that explained to me? "You shou…

I have no idea why someone would get mad about getting a vacuum cleaner as a gift. It's boring, sure, but if you keep complaining about your old one, it seems pretty thoughtful.

Everyone’s situation is different. But typically the reason this offends is because for a stay at home mom a vacuum is a work tool. If the current vacuum is broken then you should just get a new one. It shouldn’t take the place of a Christmas present, which is the opportunity to get her something related to her personal interests rather than her job.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#116

Post by ento »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #17
cogman10 wrote: post #13

Beautiful story but with a sad undertone. A large percentage of the homeless have autism [1]. And that really sucks. If these people don't have support, their lives can turn miserable fast. And unfortunately it's just way too easy for these people to end up in abusive situations. It's a lot of work to care for people with autism (moderate to severe). There is no standard for what they need, their capabilities can be…

Happy Christmas, folks! > please have some humanity about the homeless In the US, the homeless population exploded , in the 1980s, when they closed down all the mental institutions. Before that, there was a far less pervasive homeless population in urban areas. Being "on the spectrum," myself (but highly functional), I can attest to how easy it is for an autistic person's life to go sideways. Many autistic folks have…

> people will always end up being frightened of "the difference"

I've also come to accept this about myself, but I had to stumble through a dark tunnel of feeling inadequate and feeling like an inhuman monster.

The typical list of traits that should not be used as a basis for discrimination is on a spectrum of how instinctual or fear-based it is, which I don't think have seen mentioned in training materials on unconscious bias.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#117

Post by card_zero »

ekjhgkejhgk wrote: post #41
cenazoic wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Overall, 76% of female murders and 56% of male murders were perpetrated by someone known to the victim.” https://bjs.ojp.gov/female-murder-victims-and-victim-offende...

> “Overall, 76% of female murders and 56% of male murders were perpetrated by someone known to the victim.” > https://bjs.ojp.gov/female-murder-victims-and-victim-offende ... Lets say M is "being murdered" and A is "stranger in the house", "not A" is "person known to the victim in the house". The numbers you're quoting say that P(not A | M) is large, implying that P(A | M) is small. However, to make a decision on whe…

I don't think statistics are relevant at all. Suppose the stranger is wielding a kopesh, an ancient Egyptian sword. What we want to know is not "how many murderers use kopeshes?" (none of them), but "is this guy a murderer?", and that seems in line with what you're saying about statistics. However, the question "how many wielders of kopeshes are murderers?" is also irrelevant, and the answer is still none of them. Similarly, "how many strangers in your house have been murderers?" is irrelevant, even if the answer is "all of them so far". Perhaps you only ever let one stranger into your house, and once inside she killed somebody with an arquebus, and you said "never again" - but that would be paranoia. Perhaps you look at country-wide statistics for the average stranger (these aren't kept), but you are not personally country-wide, and the specific stranger is not an average. What's more, if you befriend the stranger, what statistic do you want to use then? The thing to do is reason, not count. I think the 76%, 56% statistic (although irrelevant to a decision) is attempting to say a lot of murderers are motivated by interpersonal relationships, you know, and get you to think about what a given person might be up to, or might want, and the extent to which you can even tell, and the value of risking the unknown.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#118

Post by derektank »

cenazoic wrote: post #35
ekjhgkejhgk wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Different people are different I guess. Extra expense and inconvenience also wouldn't bother me. Instead I'd be worried that one day this guy is going to kill everyone while we're sleeping. How well do you really know someone? How well do you really know someone that just showed up at your door days before?

“Overall, 76% of female murders and 56% of male murders were perpetrated by someone known to the victim.” https://bjs.ojp.gov/female-murder-victims-and-victim-offende...

Someone living in your home is known to you

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#119

Post by seba_dos1 »

DougN7 wrote: post #95
aleph_minus_one wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The default instinctual reaction of nearly everyone to someone who lets the mask slip and exhibits spectrum behaviours is somewhat like they would react to seeing a large spider. The knee jerk baked in emotional response is a mix of fear, disgust, and 'other'ing. OP isn't making some claim that neurotypicals are consciously intolerant. I would, however, make the claim that regardless of what actions people consciou…

If the reaction is actually knee jerk/automatic before the upper brain(?)/concious tolerant/empathetic side can take control, is someone a jerk for having that primal response first. I consider myself very tolerant and empathetic and I do my damndest to be that way, but my wife says sometimes it’s not the first thing that shows. I’m trying as hard as I know how. Should I be condemned?

I may try my hardest to be a great musician, but I'm not and surely won't be anytime soon. It's accepting your current shortcomings that may lead to improvement, not considering yourself good just because you try hard.

It's difficult and it's fine to struggle with it.

Re: We invited a man into our home at Christmas and he stayed with us for 45 years

#120

Post by dyauspitr »

Since no one else is going to be cynical I will do it. This is a heartwarming story. However, it seems like that by taking this man in they got a live in maid along with an additional source of income. The fact that he is autistic and along with his disposition also probably made him feel “safe” to the husband around the women and girls in the house.
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