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Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

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Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#111
post #96

The author seems unaware of how well recent Apple laptops run LLMs. This is puzzling and puts into question the validity of anything in this article.

I think the author is aware of Apple silicon. The article mentions the fact Apple has unified memory and that this is advantageous for running LLMs.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LLMs are enormously bandwidth hungry. You have to shuffle your 800GB neural network in and out of memory for every token, which can take more time/energy than actually doing the matrix multiplies. GPUs are almost not high bandwidth enough.

But even so, for a single user, the output rate for a very fast LLM would be like 100 tokens per second. With graphics, we're talking like 2 million pixels, 60 times a second; 120 million pixels per second for a standard high res screen. Big difference between 100 tokens vs 120 million pixels. 24 bit pixels gives 16 million possible colors... For tokens, it's probably enough to represent every word of the entire voca…

> Do you really though?

Yes.

It stays in on the hbm but it need to get shuffled to the place where it can actually do the computation. It’s a lot like a normal cpu. The cpu can’t do anything with data in the system memory, it has to be loaded into a cpu register. For every token that is generated, a dense llm has to read every parameter in the model.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#113
post #96

The author seems unaware of how well recent Apple laptops run LLMs. This is puzzling and puts into question the validity of anything in this article.

Yeah, any Mac system specced with a decent amount of RAM since the M1 will run LLMs locally very well. And that’s exactly how the built-in Apple Intelligence service works: when enabled, it downloads a smallish local model. Since all Macs since the M1 have very fast memory available to the integrated GPU, they’re very good at AI.

The article kinda sucks at explaining how NPUs aren’t really even needed, they just have potential to make things more efficient in the future rather than depending on the power consumption involved with running your GPU.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#114
post #96

The author seems unaware of how well recent Apple laptops run LLMs. This is puzzling and puts into question the validity of anything in this article.

I think the author is aware of Apple silicon. The article mentions the fact Apple has unified memory and that this is advantageous for running LLMs.

Then idk why they say that most laptops are bad at running LLMs, Apple has a huge marketshare in the laptop market and even their cheapest laptops are capable in that realm. And their PC competitors are more likely to be generously specced out in terms of included memory.

> However, for the average laptop that’s over a year old, the number of useful AI models you can run locally on your PC is close to zero.

This straight up isn’t true.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#115
post #96

The author seems unaware of how well recent Apple laptops run LLMs. This is puzzling and puts into question the validity of anything in this article.

But economically, it is still much better to buy a lower spec't laptop and to pay a monthly subscription for AI.

However, I agree with the article that people will run big LLMs on their laptop N years down the line. Especially if hardware outgrows best-in-class LLM model requirements. If a phone could run a 512GB LLM model fast, you would want it.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#116
post #22

I have no desire to run an LLM on my laptop when I can run one on a computer the size of six football fields.

I've been playing around with my own home-built AI server for a couple months now. It is so much better than using a cloud provider. It is the difference between drag racing in your own car, and renting one from a dealership. You are going to learn far more doing things yourself. Your tools will be much more consistent and you will walk away with a far greater understanding of every process. A basic last-generation P…

> I am not contributing to global warming

lol

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#117
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Memory prices will rise short term and generally fall long term, even with the current supply hiccup the answer is to just build out more capacity (which will happen if there is healthy competition) Don't worry! Sam Altman is on it. Making sure there never is healthy competition that is. https://www.mooreslawisdead.com/post/sam-altman-s-dirty-dram...

We’ve been through multiple cycles of scarcity/surplus DRAM cycles in the last couple of decades. Why do we think it will be different now?

> Why do we think it will be different now?

Margins. AI usage can pay a lot more. Even if they sell less than can still be more profitable.

In the past there wasn’t a high margin usage. Servers didn’t charge such a high premium.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#118
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the author is aware of Apple silicon. The article mentions the fact Apple has unified memory and that this is advantageous for running LLMs.

Then idk why they say that most laptops are bad at running LLMs, Apple has a huge marketshare in the laptop market and even their cheapest laptops are capable in that realm. And their PC competitors are more likely to be generously specced out in terms of included memory. > However, for the average laptop that’s over a year old, the number of useful AI models you can run locally on your PC is close to zero. This stra…

By “PC”, they mean non-Apple devices.

Also, macOS only has around 10% desktop market share globally.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#119
post #96

The author seems unaware of how well recent Apple laptops run LLMs. This is puzzling and puts into question the validity of anything in this article.

You still need ridiculously high spec hardware, and at Apple’s prices, that isn’t cheap. Even if you can afford it (most won't), the local models you can run are still limited and they still underperform. It’s much cheaper to pay for a cloud solution and get significantly better result. In my opinion, the article is right. We need a better way to run LLMs locally.

Re: Local AI is driving the biggest change in laptops in decades

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to my friends, Arc Raders works well on linux. So it's very much, just a small selection of AAA games, so they can run anti-cheat, that probably doesn't even work. Can you name a triple a you want to play, that proton says is incompatible? Gimp isn't a solution, sure but it works for what I need. Darktable does way more than I've ever wanted, so I can forgive it for the one time it crashed. Inkscape and ble…

I don't really PC game anymore, use my Xbox or a few older games my laptop's iGPU can handle, not at the moment anyway. Battlefield 6 is a big one recently that if I had a gaming PC set-up I'd probably want to play. I know Adobe are... c-words, but their software is industry standard for a reason.

> Battlefield 6 is a big one recently that if I had a gaming PC set-up I'd probably want to play.

We definitely play very different games, I wouldn't touch it if you paid me. So I'm sure we both have a bit of sample bias in our expected rates of linux compatibility. Especially since EA is another company like Adobe. Also, the internet seems to think they have a cheating problem. I wonder how bad it really is, and if it's worth the cost of the anti-cheat.

They're industry standard because they were first. Not necessarily because they were better. They do have a feature set that's near impossible to beat, not even I can pretend like they don't. I'm just saying, respect and fairness is more important to me, than content aware fill ever will be.

Also, doesn't the Adobe suite work on Linux?

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