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The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

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Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#111
I don't get why they bother changing the aspect ratio in the first place. What audience is saying, "I want a weird one-off version of the show in HD, please"?

Most of these shows were shot for 4:3. Directors framed for 4:3, lit for 4:3, blocked scenes for 4:3, and even built their special effects around 4:3. Stretching that work into widescreen feels a bit like deciding to colorize Citizen Kane, Dr. Strangelove, or The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. It solves a problem no one actually has.

Viewers are already used to black bars, and we watch lower-resolution content constantly. Vertical phone clips shot by amateurs on TikTok, grainy GIFs, and IMAX footage down-scaled to fit our phone (and connection). Content that wasn't designed to fill the entire screen isn't the issue.

From what I've seen, most of these old shows end up on free or bargain streaming services packed with ads. I watched an episode of Highway to Heaven with my dad where they sped up the dialogue and trimmed pauses, squeezed the credits into a tiny picture-in-picture box, and still lopped off another minute so the episode ended mid-sentence. All of that was just to make room for extra commercial slots the original show was never designed to accommodate. Disgusting, really... though I suppose you get what you pay for.

Sticking with the original 4:3 and simply adding pillarbox bars is cleaner, simpler, and far more respectful -- and ultimately more enjoyable for the audience.

Relevant :

* "That Was A Mistake": Steven Spielberg Admits He Regrets Removing Guns From E.T. // https://screenrant.com/et-guns-removed-steven-spielberg-regr...

* 5 Worst Changes Star Wars Made From The Original Cuts // https://screenrant.com/worst-changes-star-wars-special-editi...

* 'Casablanca' gets colorized, but don't play it again, Ted | Interviews | Roger Ebert // https://www.rogerebert.com/interviews/casablanca-gets-colori...

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#112
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never watched the widescreen version of The Wire they put out years ago but now I'm curious again. That show was a bone deep 4:3 product and the show plays with it constantly. Here is an interesting breakdown that made me really appreciate how clever they got while trying to be pretty subdued with the cinematography on The Wire https://vimeo.com/39768998

David Simon's earlier work, "Homicide" had a lot of interesting switching between film + video and aspect ratios as well. I think it's something that he's been interested in for a long time.

David Simon wrote the source material for Homicide but did not "make" the show, he cut his teeth in TV writing on Homicide.

I have Homicide on DVD, it also has some good extras.

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#113

Fun fact: The X-Files production team foresaw the coming of 16:9 home entertainment, so they made some effort (increasing with later seasons) to try and "protect" a 16:9 frame, which allowed for an unusually good 16:9 Blu-ray restoration. [ https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7499/look-inside-the-files... ] I learned this from the older X-files DVDs, which have some unusually good special features.

When you have an OLED screen then 4:3 aspect ratio is fine because the black bars aren't backlit, so it's not a problem.

I mean I personally would prefer a 4:3 restoration anyway, because composition and its relation to mise en scene are important to me, but c'est la vie.

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#114

Fun fact: The X-Files production team foresaw the coming of 16:9 home entertainment, so they made some effort (increasing with later seasons) to try and "protect" a 16:9 frame, which allowed for an unusually good 16:9 Blu-ray restoration. [ https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7499/look-inside-the-files... ] I learned this from the older X-files DVDs, which have some unusually good special features.

Not to dismiss the X-files team, but 16:9 was already around when they started. Just not in the states. Japan started getting 16:9 CRTs in the early 90s, Europe followed in the mid 90s. America lagged another half decade and effectively skipped 16:9 CRTs mostly going straight to plasma/lcd.

Japan has been ahead of the curve on a lot of home media related technology, not least because they manufactured a lot of it.

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#115
post #8

Great article, I really thought it was a recropping like friends (and many others). So weird that they just forgot about CGI.

https://www.vulture.com/article/mad-men-hbo-max-4k-rerelease... has more. Some finger-pointing going on here right now - HBO claims they got 'incorrect files' from Lionsgate. Either way we had clankers doing most of the work, clearly.

So have they fixed everything? You'd think when it's this bad they'd just pull it for a day or however long it takes to fix.

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#116

This could be an EXCELLENT marketing opportunity. Set up a site for fans to point out errors and vote on them. Then have HBO have just one editor interact with fans on the site, fix the most popular errors, and talk about them, maybe stream a little of the editing process.

Yes a bit like modern car companies do by pushing out whatever untested experimental feature they have and let the customers figure them out (or die).

Or just regular software companies. Microsoft's been beta testing on actual users since MS-DOS!

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#117
I remember seeing how TV had to take into account numerous formats, specially in the transition from tube to flat screens. Shame that no one takes that into account any more.

If you have an old TV with an off format you will miss a portion of the intended frame.

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#118

100% chance I would have never noticed the "puke hose" tech in the background. I never saw the Gorilla in that classic "basketball video".

Exactly what I was going to say. I didn't even see it in the still photo until I looked carefully. The eye focuses on the main action, and that area is relatively small. The brain "fills in" the detail around your center of vision. Illusionists exploit this regularly.

There was a post here maybe a month ago that exposes how small the actual "high definition" center of vision (fovea centralis) is. You can really see detail only in a small area at the center of your vision. Outside of that, the brain fills in what it thinks should be there.

https://www.shadertoy.com/view/4dsXzM

Re: The "Mad Men" in 4K on HBO Max Debacle

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You would have thought people in the business would know about this. People in the business world seems to only know business, and that's the limit of what they care about. Place these people into the arts, and you quickly see how important it is to have at least a single ounce of care when you work on projects where you want some level of quality. But I think HBO, Netflix and most TV/streaming services are run by…

> People in the business world seems to only know business, and that's the limit of what they care about. You’d think these people would go off and be executives at a ball bearing manufacturing company or something and leave the arts alone, but it never happens that way.

Why do business without glamor when you can do business with glamor?
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