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PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

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Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#111

Post by nojs »

zonghao wrote: post #100
AndriyKunitsyn wrote: post #82

"Artificial intelligence" in Chinese is "人工智能". "人" is "human", "工" is "work", so "人工" becomes "man-made". "智" is "wisdom", "能" is "able", so "智能" is "intelligence". Nouns flow into verbs and into adjectives much more freely than in English. One character is one LLM token. It seems like the perfect language for LLMs?

I think this might be why, during the reasoning process of GPT and Gemini, even for purely English prompts the model may choose to think in Chinese. That may make it easier for the model to express what it means, and thus be more conducive to its reasoning. Of course, a better way to reason is to think in vector space rather than by producing tokens that humans can read.

Surprisingly my experience has been the opposite with qwen, if you can force the thinking trace to English the results seem better. But probably just due to the amount of training data.

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#112

Post by charlescearl »

Jamestown Foundation was founded by former CIA director to support Soviet defectors and seems to have employed former employees. A 2021 FOIA request that the agency provide all records related to its interaction with the foundation was denied https://www.muckrock.com/foi/united-states-of-america-10/foi...

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#113

Post by zqy123007 »

XenophileJKO wrote: post #33
andy_xor_andrew wrote: post #18

> former Dean of Electronics Engineering and Computer Science at Peking University, has noted that Chinese data makes up only 1.3 percent of global large-model datasets (The Paper, March 24). Reflecting these concerns, the Ministry of State Security (MSS) has issued a stark warning that “poisoned data” (数据投毒) could “mislead public opinion” (误导社会舆论) (Sina Finance, August 5). from a technical point of view, I suppose i…

I was thinking about this yesterday. My personal opinion is that the PRC will face a self created headwind that likely, structurally, will prevent them from leading in AI. As the model get's more powerful, you can't simply train the model on your narrative if it doesn't align with real data/world. At some capacity, the model will notice and then it becomes a can of worms. This means they need to train the model to be…

There are different techniques and namings. Essentially, EVERY model is biased/aligned towards something, perhaps its creator's value. China or NOT. Look at Grok and read Elon Look at Claude and Dario

I am sure OpenAI and GDM have some secret alignment sets which are not pilled towards the interet of general public, they just smart enough to NOT talking about it out loud...

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#114

Post by scooke »

pfannkuchen wrote: post #79
intalentive wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>As the model get's more powerful, you can't simply train the model on your narrative if it doesn't align with real data/world. That’s what “AI alignment” is. Doesn’t seem to be hurting Western models.

Western models can be lead off the reservation pretty easily, at least at this point. I’ve gotten some pretty gnarly un-PC “opinions” out of ChatGPT. So if people are influenced by that kind of stuff, it does seem to be hurting in the way the PRC is worried about.

That is such an unnecessary turn of phrase to use, "off the reservation", and it's time to stop using it. This society doesnt (generally) use rape terminology, or other terms associated with crime, deviancy, or other unpleasantness to talk about technology, so why do phrases stemming from Indigenous situations still persist?

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#115

Post by catlifeonmars »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #60
boznz wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as an aside; Why is "intelligence" always considered to be more data? Giving a normal human a smartphone does not make them as intelligent as Newton or Einstein, any entity with sufficient grounding in logic and theory that a normal schoolkid gets should be able to get to AGI, looking up any new data they need as required.

“Knowing and being capable to do more things” would be a better description. Giving a human a smartphone, technically, let’s then do more things than Newton/Einstein.

Idk if you see what humans do with smartphones but most of us just mindlessly scroll TikTok.

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#116

Post by krageon »

JohnKemeny wrote: post #24

Is "PRC" a common abbreviation? Does it mean "China", or does it mean something else? Why not write China? I'm from KOS* (neighbor country of KON* and ROF*), so I don't know much. * Kingdom of Sweden , Kingdom of Norway , Republic of Finland .

It's not really common except in a specific political climate (specifically one pressured by propaganda). Unlike the examples of the two koreas, colloquially the two chinas (communist china - commonly known as china - and fascist china, commonly known as taiwan) are not confusing. There's very little advantage to be gained by referring to what every reader knows as china as the PRC other than to emphasise some veiled pressure for people to figure out why on earth anyone would use that name. And in so doing discover the history of taiwan (but not too much history, lest we figure out that the origins of taiwan suck big time).

In essence, it's an artefact of propaganda.

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#117

Post by Libidinalecon »

leosanchez wrote: post #8
fragmede wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI Threatens the Workforce Under communism, why is this a thing? I know that China hasn't been strictly communist since the Soviets fell but ostensibly, humanoid AI robots under semi-communism is a the dream, no?

Is it even semi-communism though? IIRC you can't even have an independent union in China

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat_theory_(Deng_Xiaoping)

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#119

Post by corimaith »

skissane wrote: post #74
XenophileJKO wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking about this yesterday. My personal opinion is that the PRC will face a self created headwind that likely, structurally, will prevent them from leading in AI. As the model get's more powerful, you can't simply train the model on your narrative if it doesn't align with real data/world. At some capacity, the model will notice and then it becomes a can of worms. This means they need to train the model to be…

> As the model get's more powerful, you can't simply train the model on your narrative if it doesn't align with real data/world. > At some capacity, the model will notice and then it becomes a can of worms. I think this is conflating “is” and “ought”, fact and value. People convince themselves that their own value system is somehow directly entailed by raw facts, such that mastery of the facts entail acceptance of th…

It's not vulnerability to western progressivism (which isn't taken seriously on a academic level) but postmodern or poststructuralist critique, which authoritarian states are still privy both as a condition in their general societies in depravity and as exposing epistemic flaws in their narratives.

Re: PRC elites voice AI-skepticism

#120

Post by woooooo »

janalsncm wrote: post #49
fragmede wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI Threatens the Workforce Under communism, why is this a thing? I know that China hasn't been strictly communist since the Soviets fell but ostensibly, humanoid AI robots under semi-communism is a the dream, no?

In a command economy the unemployment rate can be zero as everyone can be allocated a job. China is not a command economy, it is more like state capitalist which means the government owns/controls companies in key industries. Companies like Huawei have board members in the CCP but it’s a societal issue if a lot of private companies decide to automate their factories and displace tons of factory workers.

FYI, about 10% of the population in China are party members and you have to be invited, its seen as a good way of getting ahead and building your network. So most board members of most companies are probably party members.
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