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Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

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Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#111

Post by cmrdporcupine »

danielvaughn wrote: post #79
yodsanklai wrote: post #65

Seems about right for me (older developer at a big tech company). But we need to define what it means that the code is AI-generated. In my case, I typically know how I want the code to look like, and I'm writing a prompt to tell the agent to do it. The AI doesn't solve any problem, it just does the typing and helps with syntax. I'm not even sure I'm ultimately more productive.

Yeah I’m still not more productive. Maybe 10% more. But it alleviates a lot of mental energy, which is very nice at the age of 40.

Strangely I've found myself more exhausted at the end of the week and I think it's because of the constant supervision necessary to stop Claude from colouring outside the lines when I don't watch it like a hawk.

Also I tend to get more done at a time, it makes it easier to get started on "gruntwork" tasks that I would have procrastinated on. Which in turn can lead to burnout quite quickly.

I think in the end it's just as much "work", just a different kind of work and with more quantity as a result.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#112

Post by theonething »

another_twist wrote: post #96
INTPenis wrote: post #41

I wouldn't say I'm old, but I suddenly fell into the coding agent rabbit hole when I had to write some Python automations against Google APIs. Found myself having 3-4 different sites open for documentation, context switching between 3 different libraries. It was a lot to take in. So I said, why not give AI a whirl. It helped me a lot! And since then I have published at least 6 different projects with the help of AI.…

When it comes to dealing with shitty platforms AI is really the best thing ever. I have had the misfortune of writing automations for Atlassian with their weird handling of refresh keys and had AI not pointed out that Atlassian had the genius idea of invalidating refresh keys after single use, I would have wasted a lot more of my time. For this sort of manual labout, AI is the best tool there is.

> invalidating refresh keys after single use

That's called refresh token rotation and is a valid security practice.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#113

Post by mgh95 »

cornel_io wrote: post #104
mgh95 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why mock at all? Spend the time making integration tests fast. There is little reason a database, queue, etc. can't be set up in a per-test group basis and be made fast. Reliable software is built upon (mostly) reliable foundations.

There are thousands of projects out there that use mocks for various reasons, some good, some bad, some ugly. But it doesn't matter: most engineers on those projects do not have the option to go another direction, they have to push forward.

In this context, why not refactor (and have your LLM of choice) write and optimize the integration tests for you? If the crux of the argument for LLMs is that it is capable of producing sufficient quality software and dramatically reduced costs, why not have it rewrite tests?

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#114

Post by shiandow »

apt-apt-apt-apt wrote: post #106
ottah wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you have to keep dismissing incorrect auto-complete? For me I have a particular idea in mind, and I find auto-complete to be incredibly annoying. It breaks flow. It has no idea my intention, but very eagerly provides suggestions I have to stop and swat away.

Yeah, [autocomplete: I totally agree] it's so [great to have auto-complete] annoying to constantly [have to type] have tons of text dumped into your text area. Sometimes it looks plausibly right, but with subtle little issues. And you have to carefully analyze whatever it output for correctness (like constant code review).

That we're trying to replace entry/mediocre/expert level code writing with entry/mediocre/expert level code reading is one of the strangest aspects of this whole AI paradigm.

There's literally no way I can see that resulting in better quality, so either that is not what is happening or we're in for a rude awakening at some point.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#115

Post by Gigachad »

davemp wrote: post #103
Gigachad wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've tried the interactive debuggers but I'm yet to find a situation where they worked better than just printing. I use an interactive console to test what stuff does, but inline in the app I've never had anything that printing wasn't the straightforward fast solution.

I’m only found them to be useful in gargantuan OOP piles where the context is really hard to keep in your head and getting to any given point in execution can take minutes. In those cases interactive debugging has been invaluable.

I guess that’s the difference. I do rails dev mostly and it’s just put a print statement in, then run the unit test. It’s a fast feedback loop.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#116

Post by unconed »

lpapez wrote: post #63

This article goes completely against my experience so far. I teach at an internship program and the main problem with interns since 2023 has been their over reliance on AI tools. I feel like I have to teach them to stop using AI for everything and think through the problem so that they don't get stuck. Meanwhile many of the seniors around me are stuck in their ways, refusing to adopt interactive debuggers to replace…

The old fogeys don't rely on printf because they can't use a debugger, but because a debugger stops the entire program and requires you to go step by step.

Printf gives you an entire trace or log you can glance at, giving you a bird's eye view of entire processes.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#117

Post by platevoltage »

Gigachad wrote: post #97
manoDev wrote: post #14

“AI” is great for coding in the small, it’s like having a powerful semantic code editor, or pairing with a junior developer who can lookup some info online quickly. The hardest part of the job was never typing or figuring out some API bullshit anyway. But trying to use it like “please write this entire feature for me” (what vibe coding is supposed to mean) is the wrong way to handle the tool IMO. It turns into a spec…

I find this half state kind of useless. If I have to know and understand the code being generated, it's easier to just write it myself. The AI tools can just spit out function names and tools I don't know off the top of my head, and the only way to check they are correct is to go look up the documentation, and at that point I've just done the hard work I wanted to avoid. Feels like a similar situation to self driving…

> The AI tools can just spit out function names and tools I don't know off the top of my head, and the only way to check they are correct is to go look up the documentation, and at that point I've just done the hard work I wanted to avoid.

This is exactly my experience, but I guess generating code with depreciated methods is useful for some people.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#118

Post by platevoltage »

gerdesj wrote: post #90

Really? I'm not a coder but a sysadmin. 35 years or so. I'm conversant with Perl, Python, (nods to C), BASIC, shell, Powershell, AutoIT (int al) I muck about with CAD - OpenSCAD, FreeCAD, and 3D printing. I'm not a senior developer - I pay them. LLMs are handy in the same way I still have my slide rules and calculators (OK kids I use a calc app) but I do still have my slide rules. ChatGPT does quite well with the bas…

I just got back into OpenSCAD after recently getting my first new 3D Printer in 10 years, so I basically had to relearn it. ChatGPT got the syntax wrong for the most basic of operations.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#119

Post by platevoltage »

mihaitodor wrote: post #89

LMFTFY: a third of senior developers who answer surveys say over half of their code is AI-generated

Haha right. I would imagine a "Senior Developer" who is super into AI assisted coding would be more likely to come across this survey and want to participate.

Re: Survey: a third of senior developers say over half their code is AI-generated

#120

Post by gnerd00 »

shiandow wrote: post #114
apt-apt-apt-apt wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, [autocomplete: I totally agree] it's so [great to have auto-complete] annoying to constantly [have to type] have tons of text dumped into your text area. Sometimes it looks plausibly right, but with subtle little issues. And you have to carefully analyze whatever it output for correctness (like constant code review).

That we're trying to replace entry/mediocre/expert level code writing with entry/mediocre/expert level code reading is one of the strangest aspects of this whole AI paradigm. There's literally no way I can see that resulting in better quality, so either that is not what is happening or we're in for a rude awakening at some point.

there is no "we" or at least not sufficiently differentiated. Another layer is inserted into .. everything? think MSFT Teams. Your manager's manager is being empowered.. you become a truck driver who must stay on the route, on schedule or be replaced.
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