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Eleven Music

elevenlabs.io

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Re: Eleven Music

#111

Post by CamperBob2 »

anigbrowl wrote: post #108
CamperBob2 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It's just pushing a button on the camera."

This is a stupid argument, because even with the most automatic camera you have to point it at something and make a decision about what to frame in. AI music is more like buying a bunch of old unlabelled records from a bargain bin and then praising yourself whenever one of them turns out to be worth listening to.

Of course it's a stupid argument, but it's exactly what the ancestors of today's AI naysayers said when photography became practical.

Then again, it's possible for an art form to exhaust its own possibilities. To the extent that "prompt engineering" is sufficient to generate any music or artwork we have in mind, that seems like an indication that we've reached that point. To the extent that it's not sufficient, that seems like an indication that there's still interesting stuff left to do.

Either way, if you are hoping that things will stay the same, then I'm afraid that neither art nor technology are good career choices.

Re: Eleven Music

#112

Post by Krasnol »

viccis wrote: post #79
moritzwarhier wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Entertainment gives the viewer what they want, and art intends to challenge This is a fruitless and snobby dichotomy that was attempted so many times in human history, and it makes no sense. There will always be art made for success and/or money, but drawing a line is futile. Händel used to be a bit like a pop musician. And intellectual snobbishness or noble ideas do not make art more valuable. A kid singing Wonder…

>Händel used to be a bit like a pop musician. Handel was never a "bit like a pop musician." This fundamentally misunderstands how music during his time, mostly funded and enjoyed under religion and wealthy patronage contexts, was listened to. Mostly only the wealthy listened to his works, and those elite audiences were prone to viciously enforcing stylistic norms. The only real way the working class heard his works w…

Well, in the end, the only thing this snobbery does is that it makes you look/sound old.

Nobody cares. I've heard the same thing when electronic music came up. The old ones couldn't stop complaining about this "computer music" where nobody does real handwork anymore.

I see it as democratisation of art. Everybody can do it now and this is a good thing.

Let's face reality. There is no way back. We'll see what comes of it. I've seen fascinating videos recently on reddit. Things people came up with and would have never gotten the budget to be made. It's great.

Re: Eleven Music

#113

Post by dawnerd »

throwawayoldie wrote: post #42

[flagged]

It's already bad enough before this came out on the different streaming platforms. People are grifting off known musicians and labeling them as album artists to get their awful ai songs put into mixes.

Re: Eleven Music

#114

Post by ebiester »

throwawayoldie wrote: post #42

[flagged]

Is that LLMs? Generative AI? Anything with machine learning? Anything using a public model? Does that include something like Baby Audio TAIP? Noise removal software that uses ML?

How about Refik Anadol?

Re: Eleven Music

#115

Post by bjt »

What did you train the model on? Assuming it was trained on all the music online, without permission, it's kinda shitty to take all musicians' work like that and use it to make a product to put them out of business.

I draw a distinction here from LLMs used for writing code. Plenty of people freely put their code on Github or in Stack Overflow with the expectation that people could freely copy and use it. Relatively little music is shared so permissively.

(And before someone cries "fair use", I'm making an ethical argument, not a legal one. A fair use defense can protect you from a copyright claim, but it doesn't make it any less shitty to take other people's art, blend it all together, and use the result to threaten their livelihoods.)

Re: Eleven Music

#118

Post by asukumar »

krapp wrote: post #59
feoren wrote: post #36

We imagined a utopian future where robots did our menial work so we were free to be creative. Instead we got a dystopian future where we do more and more menial work so our robots can poorly emulate creativity. It's not too late to turn it around, but that requires recognizing the humanity of 99.9% of people, and the 0.1% who own everything would rather create their own synthetic (subservient) humans than recognize t…

They said the same thing about automation when the Industrial Revolution began a century or so ago. That the common worker would be liberated from the drudgery of labor and be free for creative and intellectual pursuits. The people who protested were ridiculed as Luddites who simply feared technology and progress. Of course, because automation serves the interests of capital (being created by, and invested in, by the…

Are you suggesting that subsistence farmers were better off than workers after the industrial revolution? I find that hard to believe.

Re: Eleven Music

#119

Post by ilvez »

tlaverdure wrote: post #110

I've played guitar for 23 years, and there is something just off-putting about most of the music on that page, but particularly "Yellow Bus Jam". The guitar solo sounds very unnatural, especially the phrasing, which is totally random. Blues musicians are actually attempting to say something through their instrument. This was just a random number generated solo played by a 6 finger three handed robot. No thanks, lol.

Reminds those early youtube days shredding overdub videos.. These were funny, but the Yellow Bus Jam seems just hollow and wrong. Feeling there's something from Steely Dan in that song..

Re: Eleven Music

#120

Post by Levitz »

ronsor wrote: post #41
two-sandwich wrote: post #9

If you consider that Entertainment gives the viewer what they want, and art intends to challenge, none of what's created here is "art". It doesn't push boundaries, create new genres, or satisfy an uncomfortable curiosity. The tech here is fantastic. I love that such things are possible now and they're an exciting frontier in creation. It's very dystopian to feel that the robots are making generic human-music with ind…

The fact that these models have so many people irritated like there's sand in their pants is enough proof that they're pushing boundaries and making some uncomfortable.

Not every boundary is worth pushing.

I'm hoping it will eventually become better, or maybe I haven't quite seen stuff prompted properly yet, but all I've heard coming from an AI feels aggressively mediocre and average, not in a "bad" way but in the "optimizing towards being palatable to the average person" way. Like the perfect McDonalds meal that the algorithm has found out can be 30% sawdust and still feel appetizing. I don't want that boundary being pushed. I feel we will live in a worse world if we do.

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