India used oldschool L70 Guns, zu 23 and ZSU-23-4 Shilka against pakisthan's drone swarm attacks. They are modernized to track, lock, and fire automatically. But they are cheap.
How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
111–120 of 454 posts
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
The drones reportedly flew from their containers to the staging area autonomously, where they were taken over by the pilots for the attack approach.
So what about the AI part that has been mentioned by several outlets?
From my understanding that was to be used as a last resort.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
Now imagine that but with a shotgun shooting bird/buck shot at decent ROF. Way better. The problem with any point defense system is radiating any energy makes you a big target. So you would want a passive (EO/IR?) or triggered active/passive system.
12 gauge would be fairly strong medicine, but it has to be close in. If the drone is a stabilized gun platform with the ability to aim decently well (<4 MoA @ 100 yards) that's not going to be a winning battle.
Taking the discussion back to reality, almost all uses of drones at the moment are via suicide ("wire guided COTS missiles", you might call them), or just plain old recon. There are probably still plenty of grenades dropped from hover as well.
For those uses, there's a fairly decent approach ["missile"] or hover ["bomber"] stage that is probably plenty vulnerable to autonomous PDS via 12 guage medicine.
Tracking / detection could even be passive, partly acoustic, partly EO/IR, with only a small fire control radar if you really want it.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
12 gauge would be fairly strong medicine, but it has to be close in. If the drone is a stabilized gun platform with the ability to aim decently well (<4 MoA @ 100 yards) that's not going to be a winning battle.
That’s assuming there’s a single drone and not an intelligent swarm that will circle around you.
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Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#115Hoping and praying someone in the administration is able to convince Trump to align closer to Ukraine (even if only slightly) because of this. The Ukrainians pulled off an absolute coup on Sunday. A third of a nuclear-armed country's strategic bomber fleet inoperable for the foreseeable future. Someone at NORAD probably said "they should have sent a poet" while looking at the satellite imagery. If middle powers like…
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> Death by Kubernetes...
Technically that's already the case with the F16 I think.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can we think slightly more broadly? Targeting a stationary Tu-95 bomber with no protective measures in place is probably the easiest possible identification task for a drone. A lot of kill/no-kill decisions are more subtle, or involve unknowns, possible nearby civilians, etc. Or look at this crazy FPV piloting job. You think AI could do this? Pilot maneuvers through an absolute maze of anti-drone nets to hit a moving…
Why couldn't AI do that? It's better than any human at this stuff.
Sometimes I feel like the entire AI field just never watched The Terminator.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#117Earlier quoted context omitted.
Now imagine that but with a shotgun shooting bird/buck shot at decent ROF. Way better. The problem with any point defense system is radiating any energy makes you a big target. So you would want a passive (EO/IR?) or triggered active/passive system.
We've had acoustic gunshot detection for years at this point though. It's not like a shotgun firing is a quiet event.
There's a huge difference between firing back at an enemy that is attacking, and spraying radio signals all over the horizon even though nobody is attacking yet. The former won't tell them anything new, but the latter (which I'm talking about), is (was?) considered somewhat dangerous.
When I said "triggered" I meant you would enable it when under attack, at which point it doesn't matter if they know you're there anymore.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#118The latest attack deep inside Russian borders were apparently using ArduPilot [1], it is mentioned in the Atlantic article [2]. ArduPilot also has C++ source code in Github [3], also adding an article specifically about ArduPilot and Ukraine [4] [1]: https://ardupilot.org/ [2]: https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2025/06/uk... [3]: https://github.com/ArduPilot/ardupilot [4]: https://www.404media.co/ukra…
To be clear, that's because Ardupilot is a really pretty routine UAV navigation project with obvious civilian/industrial/enthusiast application. People hack on Ardupilot because it's fun to see your drone fly around on its own. That you can also put a grenade on it is sort of an obvious extension, but the payload is very much a separate feature.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#119I really don’t get all the fretting about drones making kill-no-kill decisions. You’re telling me that you’d rather this was done by a stressed, emotional, tired front-line private? Reminds me of the debate about a self driving car that might need to mount the curb to avoid hitting a car - and therefore endangering a pedestrian. It’s not an easy decision but I’d rather a machine made it than a stressed person!
Yes. The private knows he can be punished for getting it wrong.
Re: How Ukraine’s killer drones are beating Russian jamming
#120Hoping and praying someone in the administration is able to convince Trump to align closer to Ukraine (even if only slightly) because of this. The Ukrainians pulled off an absolute coup on Sunday. A third of a nuclear-armed country's strategic bomber fleet inoperable for the foreseeable future. Someone at NORAD probably said "they should have sent a poet" while looking at the satellite imagery. If middle powers like…
Apparently the final tally was 12 planes, but still, an impressive display