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Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#111

Post by yaris »

pixl97 wrote: post #78
Trasmatta wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does US farmers going bankrupt solve?

I believe you may have some reading comprehension problem with what they laid out? At least in the parents posters mind that less farm exports leads to less water usage. Hence bankrupt farmers solves things like aquifers going empty and lakes draining leavings environmental disasters. Now, how it actually works out in the end may be different, but the concept doesn't seem completely broken at first appearance.

Honestly it feels a bit like pissing one's pants to get some warmth in winter. It solves the immediate problem, but how it works out in the end...

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#112

Post by sgc »

erelong wrote: post #75

[flagged]

This has to be a clumsy attempt at a willfully deceptive comment, right? The aggressor starts the war, but the defender will not sit by idly. They must fight back. Do you somehow think only China will do this? The US is about to get its comeuppance in a very painful way.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#114

Post by surgical_fire »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #85
wtcactus wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Negative trends of what? Exchanging highly paid services for cheap goods? EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Having the USA moron in Chief pretending that the comercial balance is solely made of physical goods to create an Excel sheet warrants a nice lesson.

>EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Their services are provided by companies/branches in the EU not the US. When you buy a EC2/S3 bucket from AWS you get invoiced by Amazon Luxembourg, not Amazon Washington. When you buy a Microsoft, Google, PayPal, Meta or Apple service, you'll be buying from a company registered in Ireland or Netherlands. And most of them also have datacenters i…

In fact I think EU should heavily tighten the screws on US big tech on grounds that their presence is a security risk.

They are beholden to the US government in many ways, and relying on the services beholden to a hostile foreign nation should be considered a risk.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#115

Post by silverquiet »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #85
wtcactus wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Negative trends of what? Exchanging highly paid services for cheap goods? EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Having the USA moron in Chief pretending that the comercial balance is solely made of physical goods to create an Excel sheet warrants a nice lesson.

>EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Their services are provided by companies/branches in the EU not the US. When you buy a EC2/S3 bucket from AWS you get invoiced by Amazon Luxembourg, not Amazon Washington. When you buy a Microsoft, Google, PayPal, Meta or Apple service, you'll be buying from a company registered in Ireland or Netherlands. And most of them also have datacenters i…

What makes these EU companies part of the American companies then?

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#116

Post by ViewTrick1002 »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #85
wtcactus wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Negative trends of what? Exchanging highly paid services for cheap goods? EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Having the USA moron in Chief pretending that the comercial balance is solely made of physical goods to create an Excel sheet warrants a nice lesson.

>EU needs to start taxing heavily any services provided here by the USA. Their services are provided by companies/branches in the EU not the US. When you buy a EC2/S3 bucket from AWS you get invoiced by Amazon Luxembourg, not Amazon Washington. When you buy a Microsoft, Google, PayPal, Meta or Apple service, you'll be buying from a company registered in Ireland or Netherlands. And most of them also have datacenters i…

Tariff licensing costs.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#117

Post by blooalien »

stevenAthompson wrote: post #79
alephnerd wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manufacturing isn't returning to the US due to these tariffs. Just like before the tariffs, the US is still too expensive. On the other hand, it has killed cost-competitiveness for Chinese exports directly from China or via transshipment from Vietnam. The tariff regime has now made Latin America (Brazil, Colombia), Turkiye, Philippines, parts of the EU (Poland, Czechia, Romania), and India cost competitive. And NAFTA…

> Manufacturing isn't returning to the US due to these tariffs. Even if it did, who cares? It wouldn't make anything less expensive or better and unemployment was already basically as close to zero as it will ever get. If wages go up that would just increase inflation more. I can't figure out what they even imagined this was going to accomplish.

> I can't figure out what they even imagined this was going to accomplish.

The downfall of Democracy in America and the alienation of all our allies? That is clearly their goal here...

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#118

Post by jcranmer »

dimitrios1 wrote: post #43
wtcactus wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, Chinese don’t have proper elections so there, I don't know. But you can be sure that in the USA, this will all stop in 2 years with the midterms, and be reversed in 4 with the presidential elections. No one other than Trump’s fan base likes this even now, imagine in a few months when people start feeling the terrible repercussions.

I am not part of Trump's fan base, and I am in favor of taking action to reverse decades of negative trends I've seen happening as a result of American corporations selling their souls to the highest outside bidders. It's going to be short term pain for long term gain.

This isn't short-term pain for long-term gain; it's short-term pain for long-term catastrophe.

The tariffs aren't some carefully-devised scheme to work out how to reshore manufacturing to the US; they're a slapdash scheme based on such idiotic economics that people had to do a double-take because the President of the United States and his cabinet couldn't possibly be that stupid. And once that sinks in, it becomes extremely counterproductive to the ostensible aims.

Why should anyone bother reshoring anything to the US? You might escape 30% tariffs on your product, but only for 30% tariffs on the inputs to your product. And living in the US means your long-term plans are always at risk of the toddler-in-chief throwing another tantrum because, as we've already seen, a deal he makes yesterday can become the worst deal in the world that is proof of how much the US is getting cheated tomorrow.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#119

Post by surgical_fire »

alephnerd wrote: post #26
josefresco wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> $2-4k blow over the next year as supply chains react. It's gonna take a lot longer, and cost Americans a lot more money for "supply chains to react" and move manufacturing to the US.

Manufacturing isn't returning to the US due to these tariffs. Just like before the tariffs, the US is still too expensive. On the other hand, it has killed cost-competitiveness for Chinese exports directly from China or via transshipment from Vietnam. The tariff regime has now made Latin America (Brazil, Colombia), Turkiye, Philippines, parts of the EU (Poland, Czechia, Romania), and India cost competitive. And NAFTA…

> Manufacturing isn't returning to the US due to these tariffs.

Even if it did, is it even desirable?

Countries that actually tried to keep manufacturing beyond its usefulness typically punch beneath their weight, such as the case of Germany.

The US lost manufacturing because it was heavily automated and those jobs don't pay really well. They are great for poor countries, because working in a factory sweatshop is better than plowing fields in rural areas, but advanced economies eventually grow beyond that.

The US, being the most advanced economy in the world, transitioned a long time ago into a finance and service economy. It's kind of fascinating (viewing from the outside) that it want to revert to a more rudimentary economy, and there are people applauding that.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#120

Post by belter »

akmarinov wrote: post #5

Wonder whether Americans or the Chinese can weather tough times better. Chinese don’t get to protest or voice dissent and Americans can’t be bothered to

China makes everything, US does nothing. Who do you think will weather this better?
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